Celtic Banter Archive November 28 2013

28 Nov 2013 18:39:17
ED007 as most fans now agree the GB were out of order with their banners, if a poll has not already been done, can we have a poll on whether the GB should be banned from Celtic park and what % of support they now have among us ordinary fans. Timalloy {Ed007's Note - I've put one up now Tim, I was wondering how to word it to include all points.}

Just like people want to have their feeling to British army exploits known every November by wearing a poppy and observing minute silences in football grounds up and down the country (their belief, their choice, their right) the GB have also their right to highlight their points of view whether or not you agree with them . ban the GB from Celtic Park ban all political symbols including poppy's. 2 sides to every coin . I'll vote against ban . TTTS

@1 excellent example TTTS, ., .kbarry

What is an "ordinary fan" Timalloy? Anyone who doesn't share your views isn't an "ordinary fan" then?! I think TTTS has made a fantastic comparison, and likewise I will fully back the GB in what I see as more propaganda by the PLC to deflect attention away from the major issues of underachieving on the pitch. PL is quick enough to say we're a big club playing our part in a major European competition, well start acting like one during the transfer windows and quit the penny pinching, biscuit tin, profit/loss sheet mentality! Show a bit of ambition, rather than celebrating getting to the party and making up the numbers!

28 Nov 2013 18:06:38
Surely pittodrie is the natural venue for hearts v ICT league cup semi? Not Easter road.

What?, ., .kbarry

28 Nov 2013 15:31:11
Well I've read the TV online page link to GB statement regarding the meaning of the banners and the terrible injustice, etc.
The GB have interesting points, I agree with challenging bad legislation, just not at football matches. I do not agree with political or ideological or religious/ sectarian banners at football matches. I backed the zombie banner as modern youth culture.
What appears to be rolling out is possibly a semi intelligent charismatic ideologist with an ounce of leadership persuading young daft sheep to follow along his crusade road of self righteousness. There's possibly failures in his past, chucked out of uni or whatever, and an angst and dislike of authority figures. A restlessness to not conform and be at peace with the rest of society. If it wasn't this he'd find something else.
The people of and Ireland are trying to get over all of that stuff. It's in the past for them. Did the GB consult the families of Sands or the H block hunger strikers to get their feelings or permission to represent their memory in such a way at Celtic park? What would the GB do if the families disassociated themselves with the GB? Still hijack their memory?
Celtic officials met the GB before Milan game and received assurances there would be no inappropriate banners. A lie. Out popped and the politics. These GB guys are therefore untrustworthy, liars and deceivers.
Ironically they probably would like a full stadium of people sympathetic to them. Instead they are driving Celtic supporters away from them in their tens of thousands. That's political suicide. Win friends and influence people? Fail Fail. What's the point of unfathomable banners that need explanation afterwards?

Great post, as you say they lied to the club and just proves they are out for themselves and do not wish to work with the club but just make thier own rules and do what they want. Then once they get punished by the club, they are all in an up roar saying it is unfair and the club is against them. And when this happens they act as if they are one of those people in jail that they reference.
And like you say did they ask those groups and consulte with them before hand, no of course not. They are too lazy, if they truly had a strong motive to prove something they would look at all ways to get the word out. But they use our club and stature as a platform, thinking they have athe backing by everyone. When in fact they are splitting fans and bringing shame on our club which also hurts the very messages they are getting out. But they don't care about anyone but themselves, doing so with arrogance. Like across the road with the "ppl don't like us, we don't care" we are the ppl(gb)

Its clear to me an many others that the GB don't have the best interests of Celtic at heart. I doubt many of them could even tell you the score after the game and I challenge many of the youngsters to even know who was. They have their own agenda and seem hell bent on bringing trouble to the door of the club. The OP makes a great point, the people of Ireland have moved on. So either get behind the team or find somewhere else to protest!

The anthem of Scotland, sung at sporting occasions, makes reference to history over 700 years ago.
How is that moving on?
So the point is a valid one.
Whether you like it or not, some Celtic supporters may agree with the GB.
If you don't, do something about it yourselves.
The only way to settle it is through fan dialogue and self-policing.

I'm with (3) on this. Alex Salmond has so far pushed his Scottish Independence campaign on the stereotypical William Wallace, Robert the Bruce, Battle of Bannockburn stuff. Why is Scottish Nationalism being promoted, when at the same time Irish Nationalism is being a criminal conviction (Roll of Honour song, which you can buy from iTunes, etc legally) under the Offensive Behaviour at Football bill?!

HamiltonBhoy

28 Nov 2013 01:09:06
Peter Lawwell:

"Our supporters do not want this any more. We are a non-political organisation, a top football club in fantastic shape, aiming to play its part as a major football club on the European stage.

"Regardless of the political views people hold, football stadia, whether it is Celtic Park or anywhere else, should not be used to promote these. This is something which all football authorities, including UEFA, have stressed for some time and something well known by all supporters.

"The club don't want it, our manager and our team don�t want it, our supporters don't want it and the football authorities don't want it - it has to stop" ---


-----------------------------------------------


I charge Lawwell with misrepresenting the identity of the Celtic Football Club, and by extension, subverting the natural expression of the Club's political identity through his, and his colleague's persistent attacks on such expressions as made by the Green Brigade, and other groups and individuals at, or in-between games.

Whilst the tradition of de-politicisation of the Celtic Park stands began long before Lawwell arrived, his maintenance of this false anti-sectarian project is deeply contrary to the spirit of the Club's foundation, its development, and its current form. So too is the pricing out of ticket allocations from the affordability of the people in the immediate locality in the East End of Glasgow.

These two reactions against the true spirit of Celtic Football Club are symptomatic of the current economic fashion, namely neoliberalism, which puts profit before people, and must protect this principle against all possible threats.

Such threats currently include the very political and cultural traditions of the club: they are not marketably tasteful, nor are they acceptable to a governing body, UEFA, with at best limited understanding of the spirit and nature of such clubs as Celtic.

I hope that Lawwell, as a well-meaning representative of our club, to stand in solidarity with the Green Brigade and other groups and individuals who seek to express a mode of cultural and political thought which seeks to criticise, or even attack, ONLY the true oppressors in our current society, whilst at the same time seeking to protect and champion the vulnerable and the oppressed in our society.

This is a class issue, and Celtic is, and should always remain a working class club; a club of and for the people of Glasgow's East End. The Green Brigade should not be 'tolerated' and punished internally when they step outside the UEFA line: NO! They should be celebrated and championed for the passion they have invigorated in the stands, and the platform they have facilitated. Lawwell etc should take this challenge to UEFA and accept the interim fines in the meantime, not as a penalty for having vulgar or obscene fan groups (as there many such clubs that DO harbour these), but rather as an injust penalty that we are proud to pay as a Club that enables the voice of counter-hegemony, the voice of the vulnerable, of the oppressed, and perhaps even, of the revolution.

Why not, rather than shut down and shut out political expression, embrace it and champion it as a method of raising political consciousness, reducing sectarian ignorance (which sadly of course does exist), and challenging the excesses of modern football. Why not return the Club to its TRUE nature, a club borne out of class oppression, a club used as an instrument of social hospitality, as well as political education.

That is the Celtic that exists in our hearts, minds, and memories, and I believe it exists in mine, just as it does in Lawwell's . The Green Brigade DO represent the fans, as well as the club. I say all power to them, they do a fantastic job, and they are a heartening beacon of protest and solidarity in the current cold, dark, and violent mire of austerity. SOLIDARITY WITH THE GREEN BRIGADE

Nicky Patterson.
Radical Independence

The green brigade do not represent me.
Let them pay the fines the club gets. It will be fantastic job if we get kicked out of europe right enough.

God bless the Green Brigade. Peter Lawwell stand up for our club who pays/paid you millions(you fatcat)or get to fu(k, ., .kbarry

Ya your right let's let the green brigade run everything just cause they give a good atmosphere. Don't drag Celtic into this mess, the gb don't speak for the fans, they speak for themselves and don't care about the club only to get thier message out. If they cared about the club they would not continue to get it in trouble with fines and tainting our name.
There is a way of doing things and they don't care of thinking away of doing it properly only to use the club for thier own stupid way to get a word out. They are trying to control the club and flex thier muscles going up against the club thinking they are right all the time. They are splitting the fans now, is that good for the club? No, if you want to see them make an arrangement with them away from Celtic park. They think they can't be touched and for some reason think they are of higher power greater then the club trying to do "good" when they are doing it thier own way and not the right way. Shame on them for trying to split the fans

Wish the GB would f*** off and leave the political propoganda for politicians. We are a football club, a great one at that and I'm proud of our heritage. We continue this through our continued charity work and how we, the supporters, live our life. Our club is handicapped enough without fine after fine from these persons who probably were not even born when the troubles in Ireland happened and know nothing about it. Leave Celtic park to football. If you can't then, in my humble opinion, you are not welcome

Am all for the Irish cause but there is a time and a place Celtic park is not the place. Do the GB really give a f*ck about the Irish cause or is it mostly a bunch of persons more interested in being aloud to do what they want sing what they want, most of who probably have never been in Ireland.
Celtic park is where you go to support your football team not get your point across about the IRA.
If they really want they can go hold rallies and see how many turn up.

Who did actually report the game on Saturday and the game on Tuesday and why did the rangers never get reported in Scotland.

@4 marty who are you to welcome anyone to celtic park pal? The gb turn up in hundreds if you go to cp (IF) then you go as one. If you don't turn up the stadium is one down if they don't turn up its an empty section. Time people got over themselves, ., .kbarry

6) A false anti-sectarian project? Are you for real? As you clearly now Celtic's history and origin so well you will know that it has always been open to all. You should also know it is a football club which, since it ceased to be solely a charity in 1892, is primarily for the purposes of entertainment and not poilitics. This has nothing whatsoever to do with neoliberalism and do me a favour and spare me he class issue drivel. You are conflating entirely separate issues and would be better focussing on why a group of petulant and conceited "supporters" appear incapable of engaging in political debate in appropriate forums, instead chosing to knowingly do harm to a club they say they love, despite the wishes of its own supporters. Paul

Sorry but I believe Celtic was started to feed the poor of the east end, Irish or otherwise, I do not believe Brother Walfrid mentioned anything about freeing Ireland, Mr Paterson you or the GB do not speak for me, I go to watch Celtic play football nothing else, as for kbarry, who are you to tell an employee of Celtic to get to F---, you and your ilk should do one, as the vast majority of Celtic supporter's are fed up listening to your political drivel
Tambhoy

@8 tommyboy iam only presenting my opinion. And "the vast majority of celtic supporters are fed up listening to my political drivel" i'm honoured that you think I have a big enough say, that the "vast majority" of our supporters have even heard/read my drivel, cheers thomas, ., .kbarry

The GB do not represent me or my political, religious or any other opinions I have. I am quite capable of expressing these myself when I feel it is approporiate and in an appropriate forum. Unfortunately, as a supporter of Celtic, I am by default, going to be associated with the GB and their political views which I do not appreciate.

@9 A typical reply from someone who obviously cannot see the bigger picture, are you not heard by thousand's at parkhead?. Many of those thousands who do not wish to hear your drivel, tell me do you know who lead's your band of brothers, or do you follow on blindly, because it is obvious to me that someone in there has a hidden agenda.
Btw name's Tambhoy, but if you think it makes you look smart to call me some thing else, fill your boot's
Tambhoy

@11 ok thomas bhoy calm down, you ask me who am I to tell a employee of celtic to get to, well i'm the guy that pays his wages, well one of them anyway. If it wasnt for us there would be no celtic, and yes the leader of my band of brothers is gerard he is 7 years older than me, ., .kbarry

Ps@11 what makes me look smart is a sweatshirt some nice jeans and good ol(new)pair of adi-dasslers' thomas son.
, ., .kbarry

@13 Oh well wearin gear like that you will be about 12, that really explains it all.
Tamthomastommybhoy