30 Sep 2015 22:48:09
Saw a post earlier on about how great the system was that RD plays and it wasn't his fault he hasn't the players to play it. What does that tell you about a manager, coach who doesn't know how, or won't change his tactics to suit the players he does have? . Pig headed or uncapable? .
01 Oct 2015 05:48:51
It tells me he has a plan. And is strong enough to stick to it. Pig headed is rich.
01 Oct 2015 08:06:44
You tell us then, - what formation should he play? If he plays 442 he doesn't have 2 top strikers. A 442 also doesn't suit guys like Armstrong/Commons/Johansen, but a 4231 does. I also think the 4231 suits Brown and Biton. If we had Larssen and Sutton I'd also be happy to play a 2 up top, but we hardly have 1 top striker at present. Also in Europe against top teams if you play 2 strikers you will most likely lose the midfield battle! In Scotland I wouldn't be against 2 up, as I said though we don't have 2 decent strikers, and the only out and out wingers we have is GMS, and Forest. They don't fill me with confidence either. So why not back up you're argument, give us a bit of detail, instead of just having a cheap shot at the manager all the time. Fans that don't understand the game are a problem because they usually shout the loudest, put extra pressure on the manager, and cause problems. Whether it was Ronny or someone else, I just thank God we have someone who is trying to drag the club forward in their thinking! There is enough Dinosaurs in Scotland, inside the game, and outside the game, hopefully there's no more inside Celtic Park!
01 Oct 2015 08:10:25
TTTS well said.
01 Oct 2015 08:23:32
I won't be holding my breath right enough!
01 Oct 2015 08:37:10
Delphic you say your glad we have someone who is trying to drag the club forward in their thinking. Could you actually tell us where we have made any advances in the last 18 months? I'm probably a dinosaur who believes that domestically it is best we play 2 up top as we don't have a good lone striker and that is why we need 2 up top to give more opportunities to link up play better or to have more presence in the box. And the area we should lessen to accommodate this is the 2nd holding player. I'd rather concede an extra 10 goals a year and score 20 more as would prob happen. As for Europe play one up top flood the midfield and hope for the best when we play a decent team.
01 Oct 2015 09:06:19
Rogic is the other that I forgot, - he is ideal for a 4231, but wouldn't get a game in a 442. Define progress Jim. He won 2 domestic trophies, unlucky in the Scottish Cup. So you are obviously talking about Europe, - I felt sick for days after the Malmo defeat, but hardly 1 player turned up that night, so we can have no complaints, so for me that's the players. There was no point sitting back and playing for a draw, like our manager said, the players should have went out and had the character to go and try to win the game. They were a disgrace though, I would say Ronny was a disgrace for his performance. We don't know if another manager would have got us through, well I don't. I thought we improved last year, and played pretty well losing to Inter. This year the absolute killer is Malmo. He is trying to improve us behind the scenes also, which in ten years will be more noticeable than it is now. Progress for you is obviously qualifying for the Champions League. I don't look at it as black and white as that. Other huge clubs didn't get through either, we're playing one tonight. It's all good though, - I mostly blame the players, you mostly blame the manager.
01 Oct 2015 09:14:59
As I said previously Jim, if you said to me Larssen/Sutton, McAvennie/Hooper, Nicholas/Cadete, McInally/McClair, not to mention McGrory/Wallace then ok you'd twist my arm, please don't say the words Stokes/Griffiths. As for Cifti, he has to earn a place, hopefully he will, but as a sub he's done nothing.
01 Oct 2015 09:23:07
I meant to say in a previous post that the players were a disgrace, but I wouldn't say Ronny was a disgrace.
01 Oct 2015 09:34:38
Winning 2 domestic trophies whilst no competition from rangers isn't success its expected and please stop pulling on the old unlucky in scot cup we got beat by Inverness for goodness sake we should still have been good enough and professional enough to take a 1-0 lead in to the second half and won comfortably. Perhaps you should stop giving Ronny a free pass and expect him to motivate and get players to carry out his instructions when we need it.
01 Oct 2015 13:10:40
Well said TTTS, Whatever tactics a manager adopts, he has to get them motivated and playing above themselves in big matches, from what I've seen of them against better quality opposition, we don't look to have a lot of belief in what we're doing, hopefully that will change tonight.
01 Oct 2015 13:46:51
I'm not giving anyone a free pass, I just like to be fair to people, give people a chance, and not be a horrible Bast£rd. It's his first big job, he was never going to refuse the opportunity, and why should he, - he believes in himself. So he needs a bit of time, and more support, from the players and some of the fans. He's only 40, he deserves at least until the end of the season, before we take stock. And Jim if you're not interested in domestic matters, fine, I agree we should be winning in Scotland, - so why not just say Europe then? After a terrible start last year, - a similar start as Strachan/Lennon, we went on to do ok in the Europa League, just ok. This year as I said Malmo is the killer. I want to see us improve, and qualify this year, even although it's a tough group, and hopefully we get a win tonight. The players need to do their jobs though, I don't need motivation for my job, it comes from within, I want to be the best I can be for my own pride and self respect. I don't need to love everyone in the company I work for, but if you see people are doing their best, working hard to improve things, try new ideas, then they deserve for you to go with it.
01 Oct 2015 14:52:34
Delphic you say commons won't be suited to a 4-4-2? It's ideal for him in behind 2 forwards. He scored 30 goals largely playing that formation. With no sustained competition in SPL it is about Europe. Yes RD is a young manager and is adamant he will only at one way? That can't be right? Rather than young he is inexperienced and he is learning his trade at Celtic, well he is in Europe! If he was a player, young and inexperienced we would not expect him to play week in week out. But as a manager who needs to deliver European football just to balance the books it was too big a risk. I for one can't see any improvement in our play. Look at the stadium it's never sold out any more? Let's see what happens tonight. Let's see what happens in our group by Christmas then we can all continue the debate. It actually does not matter what you think or what I think. It's about results so let's see. I think he will be gone in January but we shall see. Good luck tonight Bhoys.
01 Oct 2015 14:58:37
To defend him on his age and it's his first job is pathetic to be honest and why do we alwYs need to bring up Lennon/strachan I'm judging him on him alone can't you? And where do you assume I don't have interest in domestic games? The football we watch is too often poor quality and I'd be happier with a manager who sees something isn't working and takes steps to change it not persist with it. But then again maybe I'm just a horrible basta£d who wants to be entertained regularly rather than let down.
01 Oct 2015 15:00:05
Delphic totally disagree with u mate. I not a great fan of Stokes but he had a great partnership with Hooper. He is that kinda player who links well with a partner. You ask most strikers and they will want a partner. He also linked well with Izzy in the past for RD but then got hooked. Strange.
I was watchin Barca the other night and when they got in the wide areas or in the box I lost count the number of times I counted 6 players in the box and they play same system we do.
You don't have to be a great team just to get players in the box. How many times have u seen that under RD. Every time Izzy or Lustig get wide they are crossing into generally 1 man maybe 2 at a push. Why is this? That's not players its the manager.
Football is very simple mate the more goalscorers u have on a pitch the more goals u will score.
Its more than obvious if LG is havin an off day we are struggling to score.
01 Oct 2015 15:16:22
Delphic, I agree with you're posts and the way he is trying to drag us forward. Look at the young boys last night playing the same system learning a new way to play. We don't have the strikers at present with the skill set. Stokes don't make me laugh laziest guy I have seen on a park who blames everyone other than himself. We need to move forward get the ball on the ground and play football. Ronny at least is trying these things. People seem to think we have a good given right to win eveything, it doesn't happen. The players let us down now as far as I am concerned they are the ones who have got to prove to me they are fit to wear the hoops.
01 Oct 2015 15:52:59
I didn't say you didn't have an interest in domestic football Jim, I said there's no point looking at what he's done then if you're discounting his record(due to no rangers) so you are judging his success on Europe! Is that right or wrong? And as for JohnnyMac - you said 442 is ideal for Commons, then say he is suited to playing behind the 2 strikers. Where is behind the strikers in a 442? You have 2 out and out wingers, and 2 sitting/out in out midfielders further back! Commons best position is in a 4231(behind the lone striker) or in a diamond(at the top) a 442 is the formation that doesn't suit him! Under Lennon he had more a free role. Lennon played a diamond mostly with Brown/Ledley/Ki, then Wanyama with Commons at the top! So instead of patronising us with details from balance sheets, and how money wasn't getting spent on Desmond's Luxary Hotel's, when it was only a joke, why don't you read up on tactics. A ten year old kicking a ball against the wall knows about a 442. With regards Stokes and Griffiths, if you played them together in Europe we'd get murdered in midfield. Stokes has got something like 1 goal in 3 years! Also why should he get a game even domestically when his attitude is stinking, and can't train and knuckle down like a proper pro? Any of you guys that don't rate Ronny that's fine, I respect that. Like the lad says though the youth team are doing not bad, he has young guys like Nesbitt/Thompson/Luke Donnelly training with the first team, something that hasn't happened previously and they seem to really be improving. Some of them have even said he takes them all in and individualy talks to them about their progress, and their future, supposedly before they hardly got a hello from Lennon. I'm trying to look at the bigger picture, and I hope we can do well tonight and get a good run in Europe. The money in the Europa League is also much more starting from this year so we'll still make a good few quid, especially if we do well.
01 Oct 2015 16:26:50
Ray there is no way Ronny is telling the 3 behind Griffiths not to get in the box. I think Armstrong has done well, but since his injury the rest have done nothing. GMS hasn't had a good game this year, Forrest as usual, well he's had 1 good game, McGregor who I don't rate hasn't scored, these guys are in that 3 man formation to score and create. Rogic has been a big plus, and Deila does have to be ruthless and drop them. When you take out Johansens goals from last year then that's also a miss. The team in general is ordinary though. To only have 1 half decent striker, and none with a pedigree in Europe is a disgrace, plain and simple, and as you said we have no one else if Grifiths is off form/suspended/injured. That's Lawwell, and or Park's fault.
01 Oct 2015 17:05:40
Hey Delph remember not so long ago, RD wudnt put LG in his team. Now he relies upon him.What does that say about our managers knowledge about players.I also don't think he is not telling our players not to get in the box.But do you think he is telling them to get in there when on average 1-2 are all that's in there.
For me this manager just doesn't see what's there in front of him. Only recently at Aberdeen with Lustig injured and them at 10 men he put on Ambrose (defensive right back), when he could a put on Janko who is much more attacking.
Was there anyone out there that thought yea this is Ambrose he will create or get a goal? Not 1 soul I expect. yet RD thought so lol.
01 Oct 2015 17:23:47
If a manager needs to motivate players to go out and qualify for the champions league, i'd rather just lose those players. Not one player be it messi or ambrose should need to be motivated to go out and win in a champs league qualifier or they aren't playing football for the right reasons
01 Oct 2015 17:58:59
The manager has high standards - that's what it tells me Ray! Craig Gordon even said recently that when he first arrived/Deila first arrived that Griffiths was the worst trainer in the squad. Griffiths said about a month ago that he puts his current form down to training the best he has in his career, he was saying he goes to the gym every day now. He specifically said his attitude wasn't right before and he realised that if he wanted to succeed at Celtic he had to sort it out. He said it himself - surely you understand that. All the players should be doing this. Maybe if Stokes did it he'd get back in the team too! And to Jim - I'm defending his age, the fact that it's his first job because it's relevant. If you don't fancy him you should blame the board, they took a huge gamble on him. He doesn't have the experience, we all know that, but I think he is a good guy, genuine and is trying to build the club for the future. He isn't getting ready made stars to work with, or getting experienced pros, we know that whoever is behind the transfer policy is insisting on buying young inexperienced players with a resale value. The problem with that is the here and now, it means we will have periods were we will lose players - Hooper/Wanyama/ki/Van Dijk etc and suffer, that's why we should have players lined up, or buy them before we sell, so it is more seemless. But the manager is the one suffering because of all this. He is only asking for a bit of time, time to implement his ideas. I'll be the first to admit he is out his depth, and we should maybe call it quits. Give him a chance though, he is trying to do more than just work with the first team. I see he has also got a scouting agency working solely with Celtic in the whole of Scandinavia, they used to do work for a lot of clubs including Man City. He is trying to improve the whole club. The Aberdeen sub was poor, and baffled me, playing Berget a couple of days after he arrived was also a mistake. He has made mistakes but I think he is a clever guy, and will be learning from his mistakes, unlike plenty managers - real dinosaurs like Sam Allardyce who will go through his whole career doing the same things. So sort it out and go and enjoy the game!
01 Oct 2015 18:53:10
Delphic, you say he is trying to improve the club, but after 15 or 16 months in the job should we not see some improvement by now?
No one is saying that he's not trying his best, but from what I see, he just looks average at best.
Managers can't have it both ways, if they are successful they get the credit, so if they aren't successful they have to take responsibility and not just blame the players. If players aren't performing for the manager, or they don't understand the tactics, then that is the managers fault, as he is employed by the club to get the players performing well, and having tactics that the players understand and are able to play.
As good as the Lisbon Lions were, I don't think they would have achieved what they did without Jock Stein, He moulded that team into something very special and gave them terrific belief in themselves.
I'm not comparing Ronny to Jock Stein, I just think it's the managers job to get the best out of whatever players he has at his disposal. I accept there are weaknesses in the team, but even allowing for that, I think the current team is capable of a lot better than they are producing, and that is down to the manager.
01 Oct 2015 20:23:03
Delphic how am I patronising you? Go grow a pair. It's simple as this. You think RD is wonderful. I think he is poor. Let's see the results. No need to debate it really. Very simple.
{Ed007's Note - He's a smashing young player mate and it was because of him I was surprised we went for Scott Allan.}