Celtic Banter Archive September 25 2014

 

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25 Sep 2014 23:16:40
All good points guys and thanks for replying. I don't think that mentioning top teams was laughable bud as yes we aren't in there class, but the opposition we play against also isn't in the same class as the opposition in the EPL. If we do go with what seems to be popular and playing 2 strikers at home, what happens in Europe? Is the team going to switch no problem at all to 1 striker and a new system effortlessly without having played it? I agree about stokes struggling in a lone strikers role but we don't know yet about the 2 new guys, and gudetti looked like he was quite capable of it last night. Someone mentioned we played 2 strikers last night. true but it was a 4-2-3-1 with stokes wide left. (Best iv seen him play in a while which maybe proves he can't play up top himself) maybe you guys are right but I don't think we will get a chance to see it. anyway a good win at the weekend and then again in Europe will do for me bhoys! HH . Markiebhoy

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Hi again Markie, Same argument mate except it's the "double edge sword" mate when we go into Europe we are the inferior team that's why we deploy the one striker and try and stifle/nullify the game (especially away from home) I actually we got not to bad at it in some occasions because we encountered it week in week out mate ATVB

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One striker can be very defensive, or it may not . It depends on whether there are support players, how many and how quick they are in getting up to support . Playing one striker away in Europe wouldn't be anything like playing one striker at home in the SPL where he could have maybe 3/4, up in support immediately .

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25 Sep 2014 22:11:30
Note to Ed: although we ha JG on loan do we have to wait until the transfer window opens to buy him?

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{Ed007's Note - You can only sign a loan player permanently outside the window if there is an option to buy in the loan deal, with Guidetti out of contract at the end of the season there isn't that option. In January we can negotiate with Man City to release/sell the player or we can offer him a pre-contract to sign for free in the summer.}

Ex do you think guidetti would like to stay here

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25 Sep 2014 21:35:19
I'm intregued that so many people are clammering for 2 strikers as though anything other than that is being negative. I'm assuming that means a 4-4-2? If so that's the case have you not noticed that formation has gone out with the arc. Very few top teams play with 2 strikers and nobody would call the man city's, Chelsea's, barcas, madrids etc etc negative. If we had 2 Henriks at the club I would maybe see the point in an antiquated system to accommodate them, but we don't. I don't agree with some things the manager is doing but there's nothing wrong with the system he's playing in my humble opinion. Markiebhoy

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Hi Markie, It is a fair point you make about the other teams IMO


However, our league IMO as all about anti-football again IMO if we play with the one striker it will be to easy for opposing teams to "circle / stifle / nullify" that 1 striker IMO

Not one of our opponents come to play at parkhead it is to easy to counter this 4-3-3 IMO with an opposing team that play 4-1-4-1, 4-5-1, to extinguish our threat a think we are seeing that first hand IMO if a team get one in front against we ain't getting 2! because of there negativity/shut up shop attitude.

To be fair to RD (and I have been very critical of him) a think that's where his problem lies and he has never factored or encountered this type of "countermand" style & that is why he is struggling so badly

ATVB JB7

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We are no longer a top team and are very well off for strikers and in the SPL we should be flexing our muscle and our superior advantage of quality.
There is no need to play one striker against domestic opposition and in the game last night Stokes and Guidetti played well and could have scored more.

RD made a point of bringing in a lot of attacking options in the window and it is clear that he wants us to attack so we have to utilise our options and bring back attacking flair and style.

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Markie

The problem is that we don't have a striker who can play the lone striker role. Stokes and griffiths couldn't cut it that's why the other 2 strikers were brought in. Scepovic has played 4 games and no goals. guidetti 1 in 3 games. Although too early to judge they aren't setting the heather on fire.

Comparisons with Man City, Chelsea, Barca and Madrid are laughable as each of those teams have strikers who score goals as well as midfielders who get into double figures every season, Toure, Lampard, Hazard, etc.

I would play with at least 2 up front as we don't have the midfielders to support the strikers.

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25 Sep 2014 23:14:00
That's a lot of Imo,s Jamie
Lol

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The problem with 2 strikers against a team playing defensively or deep is that you are then adding another player into an already crowded space. What you are looking for then is pace and width so that you can play in behind them in the wider areas or turn them quickly if breaking on them. A lot of teams now have started to come to Celtic and fancy their chances so having pace in the team is vital as we want to hit them before they have a chance to set, that is the reason behind Mubarak and Tonev coming in.

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PMSL Dabhoy even Ed knows a have an "I" opinion of myself mate ;-)

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The problem with two up top is that last season under Lennon with only 4 in MF other teams were running us ragged with the extra man in the middle it's all about balance but I do think we need to try other formations like 3-5-2 with wing backs for balance could work nice in Europe for counter attacking!

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25 Sep 2014 18:14:43
IMO Last nights report card reads JOB DONE

On the plus Guidetti looks a handfull, Scepovic looks as though he has great positional sense (Hint to RD play the 2 of them!) Izzy had his best game in a Celtic Jersey in dun keys!

On the negative side having watched Celtic for 30 years a have never EVER witnessed a more DISJOINTED Celtic Team!

Glad the only Norwegian thing am talking about the day is that boy SOW missing the pen has reaction was SCARY and was a dead ringer for that famous Norwegian painting SCREAM LOL!

What did you make of the "double point to the ground" Ed from the Guidetti celebration? do you think that is an indicator of him suggesting he sees himself here long term or am I looking too much into it?

ATVBJB7

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Great post jamiebhoy; sums it up all nicely other than ….

more disjointed in your life….a wee bit unfair IMVHO

I liked the symbolism after the goal .

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Thanks paradise and fair enough just cannot think of an other one mate?

ATVB

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Same sentiments as me mate for the game. Jobe done.

Huge room for improvement still though.

As for Guidetti, he's a lad i've wanted to sign for a while now. He's spoken admirably of us, appreciating that we've been monitoring him for some time and the pointing to the ground/making a heart with his hands suggests he wants to stay. We should be putting a pre contract together for january NOW! He'll be the goalscorer Hooper was. Strong, good powerful finishing, no fear just determination. Think he's got a bit more pace and better feet than Hoops too. Real shame he can't play EL. Scepovic too, was in a position to score a few on Wed so you're right about his style too.

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It is a good shout JT bout the pre contract bit, boy does not lack confidence that is for sure

ATVB

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I thought that we were well worth the win after a slow start to the match.
Hopefully the manager will not make the mistake of making wholesale changes in future, as I think last night showed, we really need our better players. If he needs to rest players, limit it to 2 per match, this should hopefully keep more fluency in our play.
Does anyone know how long Matthews añd Lustig are out for?. Maybe the defence will be more solid when we have a steady right back in the team. Ambrose gives the ball away too much, which puts us under pressure,

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Hi Gerry a though I asked yesterday about Lustig/Mathews/Fisher yesterday it seems ODD to me that they are ALL out? but I accept it is possible when he put O'Connell on yesterday a thought he would push him to RB and bring Ambrose into CH as O'Connell plays there in reserves (maybe not now that Jackson Irvine is @ Ross County)?

ATVB JB7

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25 Sep 2014 10:35:03
Lets not get too ahead of ourselves here. Win was good. Attacking play better. Defending not great, but we kept a clean sheet.

Need to break game down here. One goal. One Penalty that results in goal. One own goal. So for all the effort last night only one goal in free play scored by us.

Need to do much better.

Unfortunately I don't see Ronny lasting the season. Shame. He talks the talk but can't deliver the results. Please prove me wrong Ronny.

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25 Sep 2014 16:07:18
I see in the press today Motherwell ultras again wreak havoc on their travels.last night at new Douglas park, last season same venue, and firhill, flares, smoke bombs, missiles, broken seats.i was wondering if they will get the same amount of publicity as celtic fans got following fir park last season(IMO at the time I had a feeling that the ultras had infiltrated the celtic fans and started the trouble )the reporting of fir park ran for a full week.i suppose I'm asking a lot of the hacks to continue in the same way they did with us.anyone else got an opinion on this.killy.

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Jock, I think he'll at least last the season unless we're out every cup by december and some how don't win the league. It's results driven obviously but I like to see a manager get to start a second season providing nothing disastrous.

Silly killy, you know fine well why they won't get the coverage ;) We'll hear it was actually members of the GB tomorrow.

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Needs to be given time to implement what he see's as the way forward. We have all been clamoring for free flowing attacking football and we all want it delivered in a heartbeat, just a shame NL didn't leave players capable of doing that. NL was trying to emulate the MON team by making his team big and powerful, all 6ft plus and intimidating however he sacrificed quality for that and it became obvious towards the end that the fans were bored. RD needs time to inject the pace he wants, to teach the players how to play the way he wants and to ship out the ones who either can't do it or don't want to. The league is a gimme for the next few years even if they manage to survive long enough to get promoted so our focus should now be on RD and the slow evolution of a new way of playing for Celtic.

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If Neil Lennon had created a team of fast flowing footballers capable of a run in Europe and beating all before him in the SPL I don't think he would have left us . I think most managers coming to a new club would be well pleased to inherit as good a squad as Deila has. It's not perfect but there is the bones of a good team .

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25 Sep 2014 05:59:49
A big improvement going forward tonight particularly down the left. Must be the most attack minded defence we have ever had, the 4 of them could have been a midfield unit, I do worry about that as other teams will get chances (hearts did and didn't take them) if we get a second goal before teams take one of these chances then things open up even more and we play really well. It's what happens when teams are drawing or one goal up and shutting up shop that worries me. If all 4 defenders are as gung-ho in Europe next week we are in trouble. That said I am maybe being a bit negative as I enjoyed the football we played going forward and that Hasn't happened much this season. Add forests pace and spark to that and the fact I think guidetti could be the striker we have been looking for and I'm definately a happier hoop today. Markiebhoy

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Pleased with the resust. I'm just hoping Ronny can put a string of results together and build some confidence.

Defence - is this a lost tactic now in football? Just watching Celtic, Liverpool, Manchester United (to name a few) and its woeful!

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25 Sep 2014 08:09:25
Ur not wrong mate totally agree abt guidetti aggressive and with more goals and games his confidence will grow deffos looks like a scelper

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Mrs E

i didn't think the defending was that bad last night but then it is all about opinions….

penalty was not a penalty in my view

their gilt edged chance came because of a silly pass pack through the heart of our own defence (and you cannot blame RD and tactics for that)

I think we are looking for utopia and that isn't ever going to happen for the foreseeable future

It is a pity we cannot all (now and again) focus on only the positives

defenders comfortable in possession
defenders supporting midfielders
overlapping full backs
stokes performance
guidetti performance
brown performance

the performance merited a 3-0 scoreline last night in my view

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Stokes and Izzy linking up all game, was the highlight for me - although with a better final ball we could have had a lot more goals. Guidetti looks good and I wish he was the permanent signing, as he could have a great career at Celtic.
Scepovic and Wakaso will keep the others on their toes, although McGregor needs a break and Kris Commons is still short of last seasons form and is only showing in patches.
Brown is really coming onto his game, which is fantastic, as Johansen seems to have went backwards.

We were allowed all the possession last night and were rarely tested as Gordon never had a save; however if they score with that penalty at 1-0, it might have caused the usual panic?
The careless mistakes caused by lack of concentration and complacency will be punished by better teams.

It was a good win, although a penalty and og doesn't reflect our dominance and we really do need to 'kill' weaker teams off in style at Celtic Park.
I am still undecided about RD, but if this same team gets a run of games who knows?

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Agree with all of that JJ

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To be honest Paradise it's more of an observation really about defending in general by quite a few teams these days.

I just don't know if the laws of the game favour the forward attacking players and we all know any contact by a defender results in yellow/red cards and penalties. A lot of tackles that could be made in the past are outlawed in the game now - quite rightly, nobody wants to see a career ended with a bad tackle.

Players like Neymar take full advantage of this and go down when a feather touches them.

Such is the modern game I suppose

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True `mrs `e….

I liked it when defenders could pick up attackers, slap them about, wrestle them to the ground, body slam them and then dust themselves down and get on with the game …with nothing more than a ticking off for the body slam part!

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25 Sep 2014 01:56:44
gordon (unused)
amborse (decent defending, but a poor combo with Mcgregor. 6/10)
Izzy (super tonight, brilliant energy. big applause by MOM)
VVD/Denayer (loved how they took turns coming forward with ball and bring the defence with them up to half way line - lots to like there)
Johansen (clearly a deeper midfielder than Brown, hustled well. passing needs work but a good shift)
Brown (super game 8 / 10)
Stokes (best game so far this season, like the cup final win over hibernian)
McGregor (thought he had a poor game to be honest but doesn't hide to be fair to him)
Guidetti (knows how to play in that BOX Thank the lord)
Commons (quietly effective)

same team as next time .tonev was bright .things looking up a little if you ask me

best part was the players in possession; I actually thought there is signs of improvement with passing and movement .it's coming along nicely
)

RD here for a WHILE yet; all we ask for is progress and any hint of improvement

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25 Sep 2014 14:28:42
Ambrose 6/10 you are having a giraffe mate

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I think mcgregor should be given the role behind the striker he made some good passes and seems to have better vision than common's am sick of common's every time he gets the ball outside the box more often than not he tries to shoot when a through ball would be the better option.

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25 Sep 2014 15:13:44
Big d totally agree last night I couldn't help but notice scepovics movement when he came on he made some defence splitting runs but no one seems to want to fed him a through ball

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Progress? What do you think he is trying to do? I thought someone who takes the time to attempt to give a dubious assessment of squad would know that.

Get behind RD! Its unfair to expect every problem to be solved in a short time scale with buttons spent on transfer fees compared to last season.

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DN30 "progress" means to

Build on your last performance (not necessarily the result)

It means cutting out the silly mistakes or reducing the overall number

It means making a slide rule pass to someone in a better position to positively influence the game than shooting from 35 yards

It means being more accurate with your passing

It can mean a lot of things, m but when I use I mean that I expect, anticipate, or want to see game by game week by week positive "progress" across the board

If we win our next game and have 2 attempts at goal and one on target and find ourselves relying on our goalie that would not be progress

Trust that clarifies what I mean by :progress"

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Ambrose bomb scare. It's him that makes the team nervous. He is a liability. One silly mistake in all the games I've seen. He unsettles not only the players but also the fans. Get shot of him and you have the basis of a good defence. Someone more reliable in there

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But how can he "progress" if he is not given the chance to implement long overdue changes that realistically take time?

Ambrose is a major liability as we all know, but he is only getting a game cause lustig/matthews are injured. He has no choice but to play him cause there is nobody else. Major "progress" will happen when he is out team.

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Timalloy yo posted Ambrose 6/10 you are having a giraffe mate.
What were you thinking?

I think he got it spot on . Ambrose just isn't an attacking full back but I think we are quite lucky to have as good to step in when others are missing .

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