Celtic Banter Archive April 18 2016

 

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18 Apr 2016 23:49:58
Think everybody has their own opinion who should be brought in next. Think we should concentrate on ousting PL from club and getting someone in who has fresh ideas first. Once this is in place, i'd like to see Murat Yakin. We need someone of this reputation and calibre.

Believable3 Unbelievable1

19 Apr 2016 05:37:13
If RD is sacked, names I'd like to see us open talks with are:

Jocelyn Gourvennec
Christophe Galtier
Rudi Garcia
Murat Yakin
Eusebio Di Francesco
Roy Keane
Peter Krawietz
Pal Dardai.

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19 Apr 2016 08:02:06
Totally agree DN30, Things will never change unless PL is removed. As shown in 94 it can be done so if the Celtic support are serious about the way they want our club to be run in future things have to be done asap. We can't let the hurt of Sundays embarrassing defeat heal we need to vote with our feet to remove these leeches from our club. I have said so many times that Celtic no longer feel like the club i fell in love with it has been a joke for a few seasons now and there is an endless amount of reasons to feel that way, it stretches from our signing policy to our boards total disregard of the celtic support. i have chose to stay away this season and although it has been difficult i will remain to do so (like thousands of other diehards) until things change. My worry is that Celtic might not get these fans back. They certainly won't aslong as PL continues to downsize and DD continues to use us as a toy he thinks he owns. There is no argument about who else would come in there will be plenty people willing to take over our great club. i mean what does DD actually do, nothing! get him out. Celtic fc is now spineless under this Board. Infact it no longer has a heart either!

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18 Apr 2016 23:42:16
At times I wonder if Davie Hay wishes he was back in the dugout.

Believable0 Unbelievable2

19 Apr 2016 00:40:34
Stan 19 Davie Hay is too old especially having been out of this level for so long .
However depending on who and where our new man comes from D Hay could play an important role for us.

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19 Apr 2016 06:45:18
I can only hope that whoever our next manager is HE gets to decide on his own back room staff and not have staff forced onto him like RD has.

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19 Apr 2016 08:05:20
It was more me just thinking what Davie must think about the current situation rather than me wanting him in as boss Old Bhoy. Agree he can play an important role as can a few ex celts of high regard within the support. Gaz i have never understood any manager coming in and being told who his backroom staff will be that will never work. Ronny has been handed a raw deal from the start.

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19 Apr 2016 08:37:00
Stan19, Ronny has had a raw deal in terms of player recruitment etc. but he knew what he was in for when he signed on the dotted line. And for a team full of international players to play the way they did on Sunday (and have practically all season) , zero confidence, zero passion bar one or two and dull, boring football. Ronny is as much to blame as anyone I'm afraid.

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19 Apr 2016 09:54:48
Kevbhoy I have backed Ronny as much as I can but after Sunday that was it for me also, But our problems are way about Ronny our Club is a mess at Boardroom level and until people start to see us for what we are better get used to games like Sunday because we are stale on the pitch and off it.

A club like no other. one of the biggest in the world. Never heard so much crap in my life we are a feeder club for Southampton we are not even big in the UK anymore.

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19 Apr 2016 22:59:06
If we appoint a foreign manager who currently hasn't a great knowledge of SPL we will have to help him, at the very least, with the appointment of some of his back room staff.

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18 Apr 2016 22:35:33
Ed

We talk about " a club like no other " what's your view on that?

Is it a cliche? What makes us so?

People saying we are a laughing stock. He fan base divided ( albeit less so ) over DD PL JP JC RD JK SB SJ etc

Poor match day crowds

Low budget manager upsold on a manifesto of progressiveness and youth development

Head scratching signings and lots of them

Are we a " club like no other " or a club living in the past, reliant on this past in order to project strength and grandness, but unable / unwilling to write a new fresh chapter in its history

Is it as bad many of us project or is there an element of hysteria? Do the wounds run deep and can the divisions be healed or has the TRUST totally gone?

Believable2 Unbelievable1

{Ed007's Note - It's bollocks. It used to be true but the toxic element in the support are eating away at all that was great about the Club.}

19 Apr 2016 00:21:23
We are a club like no other. Our ability to (continuously) shoot ourselves in the foot, and fail to build on success, is unparalleled in world football.

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19 Apr 2016 00:44:48
Yes we can all criticise the board, the management and the players but we seem to forget very often that we the fans play a very important role . We have a right to constructively criticise where we feel we are falling down .
However we also need to give support to things that are going well and encourage even more improvement.

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18 Apr 2016 21:39:28
I know his name is thrown around a lot when it comes to the Celtic job but what is everyone's serious thoughts on larsson? Me personally I would like to see him giving it however he is inexperienced and is still learning, wether he would take it under current circumstances is another matter hypothetically if he would take would you want him?

Believable2 Unbelievable4

{Ed007's Note - Why would you like to see Larsson get the job, can you give me one reason why he should be even considered?}

18 Apr 2016 21:51:43
No chance should Larsson be given the job! He's has done absolutely nothing as a manager so far. hopefully in time that changes and he could be considered further down the line. but now is the time for a manager with experience, not handing it over to another rookie.

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18 Apr 2016 21:54:31
Well one because he knows what it means to the fans and would give 100% as he did as a player, 2 he is very well respected at the top level of the game and is known as being very intelligent when it comes to football, I already stated in my OP that he is inexperienced but he fits the bill for the cheaper option while also being a good motivator for players because let's face it if your at Celtic and don't give your all for someone like larsson then who are you going to do it for. I know this team is full of mediocre players but if they were all giving 100% percent I bet this season would be going a lot better than it is.

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{Ed007's Note - I read as far as 'he knows what it means to the fans' and decided not to harm my brain by reading the rest of it.}

18 Apr 2016 21:58:07
I don't get the Larsson talk. As well as which, a few people on here have said no to Roy Keane and Owen Coyle because they said no when asked before - well, sorry to be the bearer of bad news but so did Henrik. And for what it's worth, Keane and Coyle are way more experienced than Larsson, and would (in my eyes) be better equipped for the job. Not that I'm set on either of them personally. Although, as a United fan I LOVE/ D Keane and think his management experiences are often underplayed - or more accurately, people who know little about it see his last few jobs and assume he's a poor manager.

This talk of Brendan Rodgers too? What's that all about? I'd rather Derek McInnes than Rodgers or Moyes - and I'm dead serious about that.

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{Ed007's Note - You're not allowed to mention Larsson turning the job down.}

18 Apr 2016 22:17:56
Giving it to L arsonn would be as bad as giving it to another Ronnie.

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18 Apr 2016 22:25:42
Well we have a problem RD was fourth or Fifth choice and RD only got it after he was supposed to be number two!

RD will be replaced but at 300k renummeration who will take it?

Lets not forget fat sally was earning more than TWICE! RD was before pay cuts (y)

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{Ed007's Note - Just changing manager isn't going to fix what's broken and as things stand a lot of people are going to be very disappointed.}

18 Apr 2016 22:30:04
Is that because you can't bear the fact your wrong ed? I never once mentioned the fact larsson turned down the job a few years ago while still under contract at his boyhood club. He has more experience now than he did back then and if you get off your high horse and read my above post you would see why I think he should be giving the job. You seem to know it all ed so why don't you tell me who should get the job? And please be realistic.

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{Ed007's Note - No it's because you're first reason was just another way of saying 'Celtic minded' and I was trying to be nice.
I could name 100 managers who are respected and I'd like to think anyone working at CFC is intelligent when it comes to football, in fact it's a kind of prerequisite I'd say.
You have no idea how Larsson is as a coach or at motivating players so that's just you making up stuff. What formation does he play, what system and style of football does he play? Do you even know his managerial record?

Falkenberg: P. 30 W. 9 D. 6 L.15.

Helsingborgs: P.38 W.13 D.7 L.17.

Helsingborgs are currently sitting THIRTEENTH in the 16 team Allsvenskan. We brought in the top coach in Norway and it hasn't worked out and you want to bring in someone who's struggling in the Swedish league? Any suggestions why all that respect he has at the top end of the game and football intelligence isn't helping Helsingborgs?
Maybe he's not giving it 100% or doesn't know what it means to the Helsingborgs fans, maybe his system and tactics don't work and he doesn't know how to change them, maybe the players don't respect him, maybe he can't get his message across, maybe he doesn't have a clue what he's doing.
If any player at CFC doesn't respect the manager then they shouldn't be at CFC, playing for the support and the jersey should be enough for anyone regardless of why the manager is. I can just see the reaction if a player came out and said he wasn't really trying under RD but he would if it was Larsson that was manager.
Well I think that about covers it - now where did that high horse get to?}

18 Apr 2016 22:35:51
Care to share why you think that aindoh? Larsson is in another league compared to Ronny? Ronny delia was known in Norway and that was about it larsson is known world wide, has respect and contacts Ronny could only dream of.

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18 Apr 2016 22:38:59
People keep talking of experienced managers, like who? Peter Houston? We will not get the type of manager most desire, they are way out of our budget and would no doubt laugh at the suggestion pl and Jp will be signing players for them.

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18 Apr 2016 22:46:40
Henrik Larssson doesn't seem the person to take risks and the Celtic job these days is too big, too soon for him in my opinion - apart from the fact he has no more experience than the previous two.
I posted earlier that Roy Keane would be ideal because of his no - nonsense approach, reputation and experience and he would possibly attract better players [budget permitting].
The fact that he had mixed success in England is irrelevant as there have been plenty Celtic managers who struggled in England - including big Jock - who achieved very successful stints at Celtic.

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18 Apr 2016 22:50:18
Yes Jamie he was that and he's also a example why just because you where a legend as a player doesn't mean it's going to be the same as a manager it's a totally different game fans forget pretty quickly when they don't like what they see on the park!

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18 Apr 2016 22:53:07
So what are you trying to say?, sally was getting paid 800 grand a year so if you want a better manager than sally you have to pay more, wakey wakey, i'll let you into something maybe you didn't realise, sally was getting paid toooootoooo much, you don't have to pay over the odds to get a good manager, you just have to get a good manager.

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18 Apr 2016 23:26:47
i meant in managerial experience larsonn and ronnie would not be that much different, just because Henrik was one of the best players ever doesn't mean he would be good as a manager,

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{Ed007's Note - Hypothetically, Aindoh, if Larsson had came in 2 years ago and had the exact same record as RD do you think we'd have been having the same discussions and debates we've had since RD came in?}

18 Apr 2016 22:29:43
Is there two two ronnies?

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18 Apr 2016 23:49:24
Aindoh you have to pay the going rate for a manager

People are talking about Moyes and Rodgers I asked Ed out of curiosity how much Rodgers was on at Liverpool and it was something like 4 million a, year Moyes 6 million

You ever hear the saying" you pay peanuts you get. "?

Circa 300k does not get you much in fact Keane ridiculed it and so did the managers association that he asked to double check it!

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18 Apr 2016 23:55:17
thats a hypothetical question ED. and any time i hear a polititician on tv, they will not answer hypothetical questions and i will concur, whatever that means.

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{Ed007's Note - It's OK, you did answer. :=o

19 Apr 2016 00:02:26
Delphic mentioned Bielsa a lot that would be a good appointment but probably too pricey for us. Michael O'Neil or Age Hariede would be within budget but Age has took over Denmark now.

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{Ed007's Note - Why would we appoint a manager that can't speak a word of English?}

19 Apr 2016 00:12:54
Ronnie, I'd have Peter Houston before I'd have Larsson.

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19 Apr 2016 00:30:32
Henrik will not put his hero status with the fans under threat to take on the poison chalice at this time, he'd be on a hiding to nothing under this board's financial constraints much as the Pieman was in Sevco .

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19 Apr 2016 00:55:14
I have very little optimism that whoever we appoint will make much of difference . Remember P Lawwell will most likely appoint the new manager . People have accused R D of being a "Yes" man . Surely to God P L is not stupid enough to appoint a manager who is going to be uncooperative with him . P L will have him well sussed out at Interview& pre interview stage that P L and new manager can work together . That's why we will be lucky to have even the slightest improvement .

If u were talking to PL, he would say R D was very unlucky, he had the team playing well enough to create numerous chances compared to them . Miss a complete open goal . P L would argue that the players at his disposal were good enough to win
So he wouldn't accept any blame personnaly.

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19 Apr 2016 01:05:10
The only problem with that assertion Old Bhoy (that Lawwell would point to chances etc and claim we were unfortunate) is that it only addresses the final result. Had we won it wouldn't have changed my thoughts on the game, in particular that first half. We were shameful. They were hungrier, fitter and quite simply wanted it more.

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{Ed007's Note - I had to listen to a drunk mate babble on for an hour about us having 33 shots at goal and they didn't have a shot at our goal from the 28th minute until Halliday's equaliser but there is no excuse for that first half display.}

19 Apr 2016 05:17:44
Chances missed, shots at goal, unfortunate, all only cloud the real issues. The possession was 60-40 in Rangers favour mainly due to:
a. We seemed clueless how to work together in pressing a team with the ball (coaching/practice) .
b. We seemed clueless how to pass the ball properly when we did have possession, so kept losing it (coaching/practice) .
These are two basic principles of modern football we seem to be incapable of doing.
How many hospital passes did we play?
How often did we punt the ball up the park to a lone striker, hoping?
Why did so many of our players appear to have cramp, are they not fit?
Simply, we were outplayed by a team from a lower division who did all the things we should have been doing far better than we did, and deserved to lose.
So what do we do, accept it and learn, or make excuses? The board's choice really, and if they go with the latter, then they should simply go away and don't come back! We sing, "to play football the Glasgow Celtic way". Is that it?
The Champions League: Do you really think I'd want us to be in that, getting stuffed 4, 5, 6-0? We finished bottom of our Europa League group, remember!
The entire coaching staff should be sacked immediately, along with a quite few of the players as they are simply not good enough. We had a gilt edged opportunity 4 years ago and wasted it.
We don't need a big name coach or players, we need a 5 to 10 year plan to change the face of not only Celtic FC, but Scottish football. To do that we need coaches, lots of them, and good footballing technical coaches at that. Don't waste money on mediocre players, get coaches.
I hear we have around 80 kids, but we need around 800, and if out of that we get 1% or 2%, then that's a good return (do the maths) . If we sell a few, so what! Build, progress, build, progress, getting better all the time. Get a style of play that's effective, and stick to it, but continually be prepared to analyse and adapt.
Then maybe we can go into the Champions League and compete, and maybe even dream!

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{Ed001's Note - you would destroy the chances of any making it if you have 800 kids. If anything, 80 is too many. What you need is to work with a small group of players and a large number of coaches, like they do in Germany and Spain.}

18 Apr 2016 20:46:19
bring back wee Fergus he wouldn't accept that drossthat was served up yesterday as football.

Believable1 Unbelievable0

18 Apr 2016 21:27:43
He was chased away a long time ago. Time is a great healer eh?

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18 Apr 2016 20:39:36
Everyone has there own idea of who we would like as the next manager but do we honestly believe lawell and the board wouldn't go for another cheap option . there has to be change and deila is not the only one that has to go .

Believable3 Unbelievable0

18 Apr 2016 21:13:09
Whoever it is and whenever it is I think the " connect " with the fan base has disappeared meaning that the next manager needs to hit the mark. The trust has gone. Trust allowed PL to upsell RD. PL DD don't have this luxury now. And that will be their worry. They know that to let RD go is only a very small piece of a trust jigsaw whereby they need to get the right manager and allocate the right budget and mastermind a clear out of deadwood.

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18 Apr 2016 21:28:34
it won't matter if dd pl jp are still there pulling the string's unless whoever comes in is strong enough to demand it in their contract about being fully in charge which i personally don't think Ronny is. but it would need to be a big name with the power to do that.

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18 Apr 2016 21:54:37
I don't think PL would watch over a material transfer of power. And there is logic to that. No manager spends what they want and does what they want. There needs to be boundaries. I think where CFC got it a little wrong is this idea that we only buy players with potential and then sell them on. The issue is two fold for me. You but the potential and the good ones go. The ones that don't go aren't generally good enough and so we need to endure the not so good players for a longer period than we'd like. We then replace the good ones with projects. And so the 2nd incarnation is only ever a backward step. The projects sometimes ( in one fell swoop) don't emerge and then we're left with a bloated demotivated squad going nowhere fast

Sometimes you need to buy a player for a fee that has no sell on value. Because this is football. It is about competing and creating cohesiveness and consistency

CFC is run like a casino now and the squad is like a trading floor with ins and outs and all manner of high risk ventures ( small sums but lots of them) . The gambles aren't currently paying off

Celtic fans deserve to watch a group of players who are fit for purpose, who want to be with us, who want success, who are paid accordingly and who are happy to " buy in" and commit for 3 to 4 years. We need consistency and we need to connect to a team that is an actual team where we can get the name on the jersey knowing that this same player won't be warming the Stoke City bench the following summer.

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18 Apr 2016 18:52:23
For me the time has come for change.
Manager and back room staff, chief executive and chairman.

Lennon is not the man to take us forward.
Let's think big and go for Brendan Rodgers or the like.
Pay the money for a top manager who will give us some pride back.

Believable2 Unbelievable2

18 Apr 2016 19:41:28
Do you still believe in Santa?
I love your intent but never going to happen here with current board. As for your choice of manager? H.

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18 Apr 2016 19:55:24
Brendan Rodgers is not the answer.

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18 Apr 2016 20:02:17
I would love us to go for Brendon Rogers but with the current board we will always go for a cheaper option and a yes man. it wouldn't surprise me one bit if Ronnie was still in charge next season. we've become a joke of a club and the butt of all jokes is a disgrace the board have allowed this to happen.

Today at work was horrendous having to listen to gloats and the " rangers are the best team in Scotland"! In my 39 years I've never saw a old firm game where we have played so badly and not competed BUT as I told the idiots today yes we played horrendous but we still almost won the game in penalties which tells me the new club are no where near as good as they think. If we had a competent manager who can actually talk at the side of the pitch then they would have changed the tactics after 10 minutes and easily won the game. Ronnie has no clue, has no plan B, the players don't listen or play for him so time to go.

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18 Apr 2016 20:31:14
Going for Brendan Rodgers is a joke, the plain fact is if you look at the performances of the Celtic team overall since Ronnies been in charge, the poor to middling performances vastly outweigh the superlative performances, Ronnie is just not a good manager, he might be great in bringing on younger players but when it comes to handling grown up babies that most professional footballers are he just does'nt have a clue, his selelections, his tactics, have been wrong too many times, I am of the opinion that you could choose any one of three or four Spl managers and they would have Celtic playing at a much higher standard than Ronnie could ever achieve, as for Rodgers, he would be a disaster.

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18 Apr 2016 21:00:40
DN30 i know we won't go for or indeed get Brendan Rogers but what do you mean by BR is not the answer? In what regard and relative to what benchmark? what about Michael O'Neill or Coleman or Pardew or the Burnley manager or Karanka etc or are they not the answer? Who is the answer and on what terms?

I think it's Roy Keane with Pat Bonner as a john Robertson type and peter Houston or jim Duffy as first team coaches but that's just me.

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18 Apr 2016 21:01:12
I thinks it what our club needs at this precise moment in time.

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18 Apr 2016 21:57:29
what exactly has brendan rodgers done that would mean he would make a good Celtic manager.

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18 Apr 2016 22:00:02
Is Pat Bonner ever even coached?

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18 Apr 2016 22:04:09
I'd have Jim Duffy at the Club. I have a lot of time for him - and he has done wonders at Greenock Morton. By all accounts he's a really good coach.

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{Ed007's Note - I suggested Duffy as an alternative to JC when he was appointed. Duffy is a fantastic coach and really likeable which a No.2 should be to allow him to be one of the boys and know what's going on with the players lives.}

18 Apr 2016 22:28:10
Totally agree ED. I think I remember the Duffy as Assistant chat. That said, I wouldn't have thought you would have forgiven him for Kirsty Gallacher ;)

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{Ed007's Note - That just shows there's hope for us all.}

18 Apr 2016 22:38:00
Exactly ed. and peter Houston?

To the pat bonner point, yes he has coached and been involved with Ireland for about 15 years.

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18 Apr 2016 22:43:26
That is a great shout it's glaringly obvious that team spirit is severely lacking, but it's hardly surprising with John (personality bypass) Collins hanging around

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{Ed007's Note - I've said it all along that a No.2 has to be seen as one of the lads, in on the jokes etc to gain the players trust. He's the buffer/cushion between the players and the manager as well as having to have the complete trust of the manager or head coach. Collins is no more than Park's eyes and ears around the Club.}

18 Apr 2016 22:44:57
Exactly. That's the sort of guy I want at Celtic Park - someone who inspires!

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18 Apr 2016 23:20:33
Didn't know that PW. Always seems to have a good grasp as a pundit.

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18 Apr 2016 22:39:06
And Morton are good to watch too.

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18 Apr 2016 18:17:22
A Celtic pal who knew I was against Deila from almost the start challenged me to give "proper" reasons why I was so against him instead of just criticising so here goes.
I have felt for some time he has no "plan B" and yesterday summed it all up, after 20 minutes every Celtic fan could see our midfield was being over ran yet Deila did not have a clue how to alter things, same in europe also.
I said on the live chat yesterday did anyone have any confidence in Ronnie lifting the team, this guy is NO MOTIVATOR, and sadly it proved right again as he could not inspire the players.
I also said time and time again he was the cheapest option Lawwell could find and sadly I was proved right again, as the job was patently too big for him.
I also said numerous times he was a "yes man" doing whatever Lawwell told him to do, accepting players he did not want. He seldom stood up to Lawwell.
Also he had no eye for talent as it was him who wanted Ciftci, he saw something nobody else saw, and we got another pig in a poke player.
He lost the respect of the players a long time ago (yes I also blame these self same players for their attitude) but a stronger manager would have dealt with these players, Deila was unable to handle them.
These and many more reasons are why I was totally against Deila.
I also agree with the view that Collins has been a divisive influence in the Celtic dressing room.
Yes the recent scouting of players has been abysmal and Parks must take all the blame for that.
As for the under investment in the team Lawwell and Dermot Desmond are solely to blame. If DD is not interested in our great club anymore, then sell his shares and let proper Celtic men run Celtic Football Club.

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18 Apr 2016 18:01:50
I keep having this reoccurring nightmare, that they're going to get rid of Ronny and give the job to Collins with Kennedy his assistant this couldn't happen could it?

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18 Apr 2016 19:50:01
Stevie I've said this before. Would not surprise me in slightest.

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18 Apr 2016 20:17:25
There is no way Collins is getting it IMO RD backed him and the team as a whole rejected JC a long long time ago IMO

Someone should have told RD of the history between our captain and him who has an ego bigger than PL's bank balance!

You look at the unity in that sevco side yesterday all interlocking at the penalties and our coaching staff all posted missing not even close biggest mistake RD ever made appointing JC far too alike in terms of discipline and fitness you need a contrast in management.

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18 Apr 2016 22:33:18
I've said it loads of times on here that I'm convinced Collins is the poison in the dressing room. I don't believe for one minute that him and Brown kissed and made up, they just don't like each other. How can you work on the training ground when the captain and coach don't get on. I also believe he has made a few more enemies with the likes of Commons and probably a few others. I obviously don't know Collins personally but the un likeability factor shines through when you hear him speak

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{Ed007's Note - I said it the minute he was announced and was shot down for it.}

18 Apr 2016 23:27:58
Jamiebhoy7 RD never appointed JC mate. That was PL.

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19 Apr 2016 01:00:38
R D had no experience of Scottish football, it was reasonable to appoint a Scottish Assistant . According to people who know Collins and his ways a lot better than me John Collins was a bad choice.

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18 Apr 2016 17:37:19
So after a day at work listening to colleagues gloating, which they had every right to do seeing as we were so bad I thought I'd sum up my feelings.

Was I surprised? No, a part of me expected this on the evidence of our performances so far. My overriding emotions were anger and disgust .

Anger at the Board and their failings in their responsibility to uphold the traditions of the "Celtic way". Anger at their complacency, arrogance and treatment of the fans and in a small way RD.

Anger at RD, JC and JK. Why do they not see what we have all seen for the majority of the season? Why no changes in the squad and particularly to those who are clearly unfit or are not trying/ listening to RDs ideas?

Anger and disgust at some of the players for wearing that jersey and showing no pride, passion, commitment or dig! I want to see them fly in to tackles, let them know that they are up against the Celtic not seeing players like Lustig giving up, Biton wanting to come off or Brown who has serious mobility issues toiling to turn or run.

Make no mistake. This should be a turning point for us. we can play a lot better, can they?

We made them look good with their running, movement and passing. We also made them look good with how poor our fitness seemed to be.

Yes we could have won and I'd have been delighted and gloated too like my colleagues but I'd still have major concerns over that effort and attitude yesterday.

These players need to have a look at themselves and with the exception of a few like Griffiths, Tierney, Jojo, Roberts, Sviatchenko, Rogic the rest should be very worried about being punted.

Believable4 Unbelievable0

18 Apr 2016 18:38:56
I think most of us would agree with that and as you say, even if we had won the game, there is no hiding from the fact that we have went backwards this season in several ways.
The fact we were chasing that game, literally from KO should be enough to prove that things are very wrong at Celtic.
The decision to persevere with RD until the summer was understandable - if not satisfactory as we are so close to the finish line and available managers are very limited.
However, now that it is very likely he will be replaced, I hope the players that got us into this situation can be trusted to deliver the title - even though a good few of them may well be off in the summer?
At the end of the day, a fifth title in a row may have been a priority, but there is no doubt that this season has been very disappointing and less successful than last year and in that respect the manager and players have not met their targets.
The board may be meeting financial objectives, but over the past few years they have not even achieved credibility or parity in football terms.

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18 Apr 2016 19:57:17
Jungle

Financial targets can't have been met surely? Match day tickets down. Consumption of food and drink must be done with non attending season ticket holders. This won't be lost on pitch side / stadium advertisers.

I know that the real money is in Euro qualification and TV etc and also that season ticket sales this year where pretty robust but even still I'm not so sure about financial targets being met ( noting that I don't know what they actually were to begin with and so it's an opinion)

The worry is next year and season ticket sales and " value " of playing side assets. Can we agree that our GK has no sell on value. Lustig no value. Boyata no value. Mulgrew next to no value. Brown no value and few takers. Biton material slide in value. Johansen ( see biton ) mcgregor questionable value Armstrong questionable value. Forrest free. CKR . next.

The point is this. We could have disillusioned fan base ( financially damaging) and an asset pool that has materially diminished. Even PL can't magic up £10m or £5m for any assets today. I'm not going to then go on and say except KT because it's still early for him and Christie etc and simunovic etc

There may well be a base to build from ( time will tell ) but CFC finances ( current and projected ) must be looking a little shoddier than normal these days and so what next?

Who blinks first? The board or the fans or neither?

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18 Apr 2016 16:55:32
Ed I know we are all hurting but my bhoy brought something up that we have all ignored, has ther been any talk from the SFA eufa on the use of flares and fireworks yesterday by rangers fans as this is front page news when it's Celtic fans, ?

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{Ed007's Note - There were smoke bombs let off in our end too. Hopefully the lads from both sides that got them in managed to avoid getting caught on camera.}

18 Apr 2016 17:46:59
I saw the fans letting them off and thought that will give sections of both fans something to moan about on sites like this and on the radio hotlines too most fans couldn't care less just the odd eejit that likes a moan! i agree ed hopefully all concerned are not found out.

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18 Apr 2016 18:43:50
No mention of Sectarian singing either, but as long as it's not racist, offensive to Muslims or anti-Semitic it seems acceptable?

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18 Apr 2016 19:59:32
JJ there were a good few bigots sitting near me with their anti Protestant narrative and so like the smoke bombs that's a shared issue ( albeit e blue corner wins on volume )

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18 Apr 2016 22:39:45
Don't be silly paradise it only counts if its coming from the other fans that's the way it works with rangers And Celtic fans!

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18 Apr 2016 16:53:49
Afternoon Ed, Usually you let the dust settle mate before "piping up"

For me, RD's time is up! The only reason for me he has not left today is so that it is not over viewed as a DIRECT result of yesterday!

There is no way he can take the club forward

Sure PL/ JP/ DD All share a sense of blame here but other than firing themselves or selling up my train of thought is they will need to give the next manager more money and more of a free reign otherwise there will be a revolt IMO

I honestly believe JC has a bigger fault line here than RD you had TWO men the exact same in terms of discipline / fitness and the squad lost interest IMO roughly when KC got his new contract I don't think SB has became a bad player or captain I just think he downed tools a while ago due to JC and the history there to

We already know PL has approached someone earlier with a view to a temporary basis but PL's "vanity" project is over for me

Your overview? (y)

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{Ed007's Note - That's it for me, Jamie, it's time for a change and not just at management level - if RD goes then Lawwell and Park MUST follow them. It's their project and it's not working, to only win the league this year is unacceptable, we should have been racking up the trophies over the last 4/5 years and that just hasn't happened.}

18 Apr 2016 18:25:09
We cannot progress with PL as CEO at club. Things are not going to improve untill he is away. Any new manager will have players forced onto him that simply are not good enough and we will still see star players being sold and replaced with substandard players.

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18 Apr 2016 18:42:29
Completely agree with you Ed and DN but how likely is this to happen! For example if this fans were to stage a protest/ boycott to have PL and park removed how likely is there to be any action taken! Us fans are the most powerful tool the club has so if we decided not to renew season tickets, stay away from matches and not buy any merchandise would there be no alternative but to to take action or would we be ignored? Thoughts guys?

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{Ed007's Note - I'd never tell anyone else what they should be doing but I said the other week that I won't be renewing my two season tickets next year and I'm closing down the Pools agency I've ran for the last 23 years at the end of the season. I hardly go to games anyway and if I want I'll just buy a one off ticket or borrow a season ticket so it's not going to affect the way I support the team - we should always support the team on the park.
Lawwell has let down every shareholder and supporter over the shambles at Ibrox and that is unforgivable, he is a cancer at our club that must be removed.}

18 Apr 2016 18:57:47
Who would you bring in as RD's replacement Ed? There must be an experienced foreign manager out there who'd fancy a crack at this!? A ranieri type who has been there and done it.

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{Ed007's Note - When you've got guys like Owen Coyle, Keane and Larsson all turning down the job because of the constraints put on them by the Lawwell/Park duopoly. It is imperetive that those two are removed from the Club asap.
Lawwell has gambled with Celtic's future for his own narcissistic gain and he has became a VERY rich and powerful man while decimating our club at every turn.
If RD is removed - and I'm still not convinced he will be - I think that the only avenue left to Lawwell is to go back down the ex-player 'Celtic-minded' route in the hope that it gets the support back onside.}

18 Apr 2016 19:28:02
What do people really think changing lawwel will do.
The next guy is going to have the same job description and targets.
Lawwels employers think he's doing a good job.

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{Ed007's Note - Well hopefully we'll get someone with a bit of knowledge and experience that isn't going to waste millions buying project after project that has cost us millions. Remember players like Miku, Bangura, Balde, Scepovic, Citfci and Scott Allan this season?}

18 Apr 2016 20:00:35
For me PL is dancing in the last chance saloon he is 57 I think and declared he won't go on for ever guys at this level tend to chuck it at 60!

I think we have him over a barrel to an extent and they will need to give the new manager more help than either NL or RD got

I agree Ed the only avenue for PL is a really popular figure to appease the fans but whoever it is has a great bargaining chip to start with in terms of boardroom unpopularity and where we find ourselves in (y)

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{Ed007's Note - He's a megalomaniac and his greed will keep him going for years yet.}

18 Apr 2016 20:57:15
Ed what do you mean by Lawwell has let us down over the shambles at Ibrox?

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{Ed007's Note - He refused to speak out over the old/new club myth preferring to hide behind the excuse of personal safety to the Club's employees. I'd like to know what Head of Security Ronnie Hawthorn thinks of Peter Lawwell questioning his ability to do his job.
Lawwell refuses to publicly acknowledge or push shareholder's concerns over Res 12. That's not just ignoring fans, that's ignoring shareholders it and is a dangerous game to play. In any other business if licences were wrongly issued there would be hell to pay for those responsible, especially by those who lost money through it.
In 2011 Spartans were thrown out of the Scottish Cup for fielding a player whose contract only had one date printed on it whilst Rangers fielded illegally registered players for years costing us trophies, prize money, European money and more importantly to some, their dividends.
Lawwell has lied to peoples' faces about both of these matters, saying one thing in private and then either blanking the issue or changing his tune when it comes to publicly speaking out.
Let's hope DD had his eyes opened at Hampden yesterday, he was sitting amongst the suits in the stadium but then decided to watch the 2nd half from the comfort of a hospitality suite for some reason.}

18 Apr 2016 22:48:59
Yes I remember them.
But I also remember JVH nakamura wanyama skippy Barry Robson Paul hartley hinkle hooper and Griffiths.
We have had success as well as failures in lawwels time
Now I ain't saying change isn't needed but just getting rid of lawwel won't change much as the next guy will be told to do the same job.
Like I said before his employers think he's doing well.

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{Ed007's Note - How many of those signing did John Park have an input in? I'm not so sure his employers do think that any longer, DD didn't get to where he is by rewarding failure.}

18 Apr 2016 22:37:14
You reckon that DD part tells a story?

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19 Apr 2016 10:47:58
Ed I sure it was reported not so long as go that lawwel got a pay rise and a hefty bonus.

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18 Apr 2016 15:32:41
Might be in the minority here but I would like Ronny to be here next season, He has had one bad year, and suddenly he has to be sacked and in some fans opinions replaced by Lennon who in his final season had the same trophy haul for that year as Ronny does for this season? Suppose he would bring some fight back? Strange tho where was Lennon's teams supposed fight in our 2-1 defeat to the now dead Rangers in the final of the league cup, or our semi final 2-1 defeat to hearts, or our Kilmarnock's 1-0 victory over us in the final of the league cup, or when St Mirren beat us 3-2 at Hampden in the semi final of the league cup, or when Morton and Aberdeen both beat us at PARKHEAD to dump us out of both cups in Lennons final season? I guess some people just wanted rid of Ronny as soon as he stepped in the front door tho.

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18 Apr 2016 16:00:32
Cactus jack, I think you are correct. You are definitely in the minority. However, I am with you on this and believe the "experiment" should be given 3-4 seasons, then judge the legacy. Season ticket for me. Anyone else joining our exclusive club?

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18 Apr 2016 16:01:56
Hail Hail.

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18 Apr 2016 16:34:47
Bankie Bhoy good to see there are some others who still feel Ronny is the right man for the job.

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18 Apr 2016 16:40:14
Cactus Jack, Neil Lennon's team got beaten off a Rangers team who had international players like Jelavic, Naismith and Davis. Fast forward to 2016 and their 2 best players couldn't get a game for relegated Wigan. And one of them wasn't even playing and got replaced by a 36 year old Kenny Miller! Mowbray didn't get time so why would Deila?

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18 Apr 2016 16:46:08
Rd has never won a game that matters in his whole time at Celtic, he has not got a clue, yesterday was an embarrassment to every Celtic fan and the blame lies at the board's door, beat by missfits tribute act is probably the worst feeling iv had since Seville, we deserve more than this and I for one am not going along on this ride no more until big changes, sacking rd is inevitable as the parasites at the top will look on this as too take pressure off them self's, as I know adverts for season book renewal has been put back a week as to try to cover this embarrassment they have caused are club, we the paying fans of the club hold the aces and we should use them for the sake of are club, the silence from inside Celtic tells a story of its self, but this one is not going away any time soon.

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18 Apr 2016 16:57:38
I understand what you're saying cactus and would have agreed with you right up till yesterday. To have no fight when playing that (new) mob is unforgiving. By now we should have been beating them convincingly. It's been 2 years and there's no progress this year, if anything we've went back. I really like ronny and I really like his ideas. Unfortunately what he's saying and what's happening is 2 different things. I've got to laugh at some of the names being passed about though. Lennon, Hartley et al. If we want to make any headway in Europe we need to move just now.

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18 Apr 2016 17:02:20
It's actually staggering that some on here are even thinking about Ronnie being here next season! What planet are u on by the way! This guy shouldn't even have the chance to see out the rest of the week never mind season! Did u actually watch the game yesterday by any chance? Out fought out thought and passed off the park by a poor outfit from Scotland's 2nd tier! It's been a disaster since day dot with this guy, starting with the mauling from Legia through to what happened yesterday! With all the dross we've had to endure inbetween! But hey let's give him a chance to take us into another European campaign so he can humiliate us some more! Wake up for Christs sake, he's got to go now!

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18 Apr 2016 17:13:30
Kevbhoy Rangers one aside, are the rest of the defeats to teams packed with international players, remember Morton where relegated from the 2nd tier the season they beat us they where also beaten 10-2 by Hamilton, your right Mowbray didn't get time simply because he was not good enough the results and performances showed that? But using the excuse of managers getting time Lennon got given time after his first season where he won one trophy whereas Ronny has won two in his first and on course for three and got us into Europe twice, Why shouldn't he get time?

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18 Apr 2016 17:16:34
English Bhoy every competitive game Celtic play is a game that matters clearly Ronny won enough last season to win the league, won enough to get us into the latter stages of a European competition, won enough to win us the league cup and was one missed handball and silly red card away from winning enough to win the Scottish cup, then again I suppose it's only games where the champions league theme gets played over the tannoy at Celtic park before kick off that count as a game that "MATTERS" to some fans.

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18 Apr 2016 15:05:33
I have supported RD from the start but I can't anymore a lot will say it took you long enough but I think the alleged interference from upstairs was holding RD and the team back and if that was or is the case it has to be addressed BEFORE any new manager comes in.

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18 Apr 2016 15:28:15
Im the same Tony. Need a lot more than a manager. Peter Lawwell has to go! Any good/ decent CEO would of continually developed all aspects of the club with no competition in league, but we have went backwards. Somebody was posting praise on this for stuff he has done, citing building the celtic way as his major achievement. A bit of monoblocking isn't going to win trophies!

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18 Apr 2016 15:35:38
I'm the same tony but yesterday made me realise the lack of progress we have made. The problems are club wide though, it's not just about the management.

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18 Apr 2016 15:45:57
Same here bhoys.

Chuckled at that DN. There's a missing ceiling tile in the cleaner's cupboard he's planning on addressing in the summer, of course whether or not we get one that actually matches will depend on just how much we can rake in for Tierney.

The guy is good at making money, but falls well short in the football dept.

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18 Apr 2016 15:59:02
Don't you tempt fate jim Tim. . we also coould get in lennon as manager ronnie as coach this was the choice supposedly before lenny chucked it . has peter the brass neck to try that?

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18 Apr 2016 16:11:34
We have been very disappointing most of the season and it's very hard to pick out more than a handful of memorable highlights.
The warning signs have been there since the European campaign and our failure to kick on with consistency and confidence at the turn of the year - when the 'burden' of extra EL Thursday games came to an end.
Too many performances have been flat, predictable and uninspiring, while our record in 'big games' continues to cause alarm.
The defeat to Sevco has got to be the last straw for all those responsible or as the song goes - 'If you tolerate this, then your children will be next'.

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18 Apr 2016 16:21:14
drb,

I can be quoted on here as saying the more I've warmed to RD (was very critical to start but have bought into the idea) , the more I have wondered if he would be a better coach than manager? We certainly need an older football brain in anyway making big football decisions over Park/ Lawwell. It's only egos and titles at stake but this person could be either a 'DoF', 'technical director' or even 'manager, whatever. Would they want RD though?

For whatever reason the players aren't playing. Too many big games do players just deliver the most lifeless performances. Which to be quite frank is disgraceful as a manager shouldn't have to motivate you to play a game of football against your mates never mind a semi against Rangers. Is RD lacking in commanding respect? Aye. But that doesn't matter, any player not buying in (and Ed001 can be quoted saying one player even admits it) should be booted. As they are a problem. They won't pick the next manager, and are just as likely to have the wrong attitude too.

The plan RD is about hasn't been given long enough. Given the probable replacements. Still worth going for in my eyes. KT is the benchmark for what we are to see in terms of effort and application. Of course the board need to play their part and in the areas which nees improving, bring in the ready made quality.

Faith is a big part of my life, and it may well be blind. But what do you have to lose? We either stick with this innovative young manager who has shown he can do remarkeable things, or we end up with what? Your guess is as good as mine with our club at the minute. The problems lie much deeper than our coach.

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18 Apr 2016 18:28:16
JimTim all the transfers in and out average £2.5m per season over last 6 years. I think PL is overated and has some ego.

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18 Apr 2016 18:37:54
NL to me is no way the answer great guy he put up a lot for us but I am convinced he could not take us any further than he did
Don't know who is the answer but NL is definitely not But as I have stated above interference at board level has to be addressed first before any one comes in. Balance the books I agree with give the manager a budget I agree with but leave the choosing of new players and picking the team to the manager not A director at any level.

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18 Apr 2016 20:14:58
DN, it's terrible. Folk on here would have spent money more wisely.

Correct tony2bhoy, NL is no better than RD. And nothing has changed about the clubs mentality since he left anyway. If RD is sacked, with Rangers 'back' now, NL will be the replacement, but for all the wrong reasons. That's my gut instinct with this. Can just sense it. I have been against the way our club has been ran for years now.

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18 Apr 2016 14:57:16
So where do we go from here? .

Enough is enough. The board is full of parasites and leaches sucking the very fabric from our club, we the fans must take a stand and send them a message, a message that should have been sent to the board a long time ago, possibly 4 years ago.

We must relieve the three stoogies from their first team duties, I would say immediately, whilst I accept I could be stoned for suggesting it, there has been no improvement under RD and Co. Park must go too.

Whilst I blame the board for not investing in the team to ensure European progress, RD must shoulder the blame for our domestic failings

The fans are being ignored and taken for granted. let's stand together and save our club before it's too late.

A stadium protest? boycott the shops, something please. A message needs to be sent that we are on our knees, we are heartbroken and desolate with what our club has become.

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18 Apr 2016 20:48:52
BB that was a really penetrate post. The part about what our club has become. And you're right. We now think that there's no one better out there than RD new convince ourselves that Cole et al are good and all we deserve because " our game" is so bad and that we are impoverished. And of course other teams with lesson eu available and no name managers routinely trounce us in Europe. It's weird how we have so very quickly become a shadow of ourselves. We used to make up for lack of talent with passion drive and commitment. The likes of naylor versus Man united or telfer. No name players that took to Celtic, respected the club and its culture and size and upped their game

Now? It's like the poor players even go about things at half pelt and that rests squarely with RD but also PL and DD for dealing him a 5 and 2 when they could have given him a faceless pair without too much give.

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18 Apr 2016 14:26:55
So it looks/ sounds like deila is getting to the end of the season and that will be his time up. If so then I am disappointed on a number of levels, after last season I really expected us to push on and start to show the type of performance we got a glimpse of last season where we were fast, direct and miles better than anyone else domestically. As we all know it hasn't happened this season and even Ronnie's biggest fans must admit some of the performances have been really hard to watch and it feels like two steps forward two or even three steps back at times.
I don't think it's all Ronnie's fault, I don't know for sure but what I've read on various sites and forums is he doesn't get to pick his own transfer targets and sometimes hasn't even had 100% control over his starting 11 which led to the infighting between players/ management not long into the season. Others on here may know better than me?
I'm guessing this would have been made clear to him when be accepted the job which is fine, every job comes with rules and you've to deal with it and keep going. What gets to me is what seems to be the lack of a plan B when plan A struggles or fails altogether. We are far to easy at times to stop from playing our game and there's very little tactical.

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18 Apr 2016 13:17:31
Time for a clear out at celtic park let's start with Lawell Bankier Ronnie Collins Kennedy Cole Richards GMS Brown Ambrose and Mulgrew that's just a start.

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18 Apr 2016 14:22:47
Blackett janko Forrest to name but a few.

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18 Apr 2016 16:03:12
Honestly; the only players who've been consistent all season are Tierney and Griffiths [who has scored most of our goals].
Schiavchenko looks the part and Rogic and Roberts will do a job.
Unfortunately the vast majority of the remaining squad have had very patchy seasons at best, bordering on ineffective at worst.
Some of them have had good spells, but nowhere near the consistency and level of quality good enough to wear the jersey.
There have also been a group of players that have been frozen out for one reason or another including Commons, Allen, Christie, Ciftci, Stokes, Izzaguire and a few others and that cannot be healthy for a club like ours pushing for trophies and European credibility. We need someone who will get the best out of our better players every week and get shot of the inferior and past their best passengers, who have got us into this mess.

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18 Apr 2016 13:15:51
If he's going to be sacked why hold of till the end of the season . Is it best not to get someone in now to see what he needs for next season because if they wait he won't have time to see what players we need for the start of the qualifiers.

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18 Apr 2016 13:47:38
If this is the case kenneth then any prospective manager worth their salt is probably in a job and would want to finish the season where they're at.

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18 Apr 2016 13:58:01
Think I'm with the majority here in that Ronnie must go .
I know he is the manager / coach? But between him, Collins and Kennedy there is no evidence of tactics or plan b when things aren't going right .
The 3 need to go . But realistic? Who would replace them? We need fresh ideas so . Keane? Had his chance and turned us down! So no from me . Lennon, coyle n Malky McKay? Don't think any should be near our club. I just don't see who would take the job knowing the rebuild needed and the fact it will be a shoe string budget.

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18 Apr 2016 12:52:34
This is the worst Celtic team I've seen and been supporting this club for 40 years. When Lou Macari was our manager and if someone asked me if I thought we would be in a European final in a few years I would have said your aff yer heed. This present situation can be turned around but only buy a good experienced manager and a good pot of gold to spend. Nothing else will do!

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18 Apr 2016 13:59:24
I can't see that happening though, can you?

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18 Apr 2016 12:20:48
I remember a few yrs back being down to killie at half time, when lennon said if you want me as your gaffer show me (not exact words but get the drift) , i wonder if ronnie said the same would he be able to get that wee bit extra from his players?, no chance not now, players downed tools a few weeks back, there's a saying that good guys finish last, maybe that's wots happened, but to all the fans that think that getting ronny out and bringing in someone else will make everything better how could it if its PL and JP making the signings?, i said yrs back on this forum that we won't spend till rangers where back in league but now i don't think we will . which worries me now, you can only polish a turd for so long before it crumbles, and yrs of mismanagement and failed experiments have came back to bite us on the ar5e, . and I've been thinking this long before the semi final. oh what could have been.

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18 Apr 2016 12:25:47
He's now coming across as a pompous tw@t, his arrogance knows no bounds, the fact that he still thinks he can offer anything is beyond belief.

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18 Apr 2016 14:06:49
Whether it's RD who makes the signings or someone else, it's completely inexcusable for a Celtic team to perform like that team did yesterday. GMS should never play for us again. Bitton went missing like I said he would. Rogic is sitting warming the bench while Brown runs about like a headless chicken and Commons doesn't even get on! RD's finished and he's done it to himself.

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18 Apr 2016 11:54:11
I have never been so split between support the team on the field and refusing to let the board think we will just settle for this.
I was young when the boycotts were going on so I never really understood what was happening
But I did grow up with bad celtic teams and have seen dark days like many other celtic fans But like I said I am torn today.

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18 Apr 2016 10:58:35
I think once a board of a football club loses their ambition for their club, then this is the result.
The complacency our board has shown since Rangers demise 4 years ago is nothing short of scandalous, they have taken the supporters for mugs. I know that at times players have to be sold but it's not asking a lot to put some of the fees received back into buying some half decent replacements, but a lot of our signings have been embarrassing.
Rangers demise gave us all a good laugh, but we should have used that spell to put ourselves on a different level, we just seem to have adopted an attitude that we will never again have any competition domestically, that to me is just lazy and arrogant.
Whether it's old rangers or newco, there was always going to be some form of club coming through the leagues to challenge us, whatever form this club takes, we have to be ready for that challenge, we need some hungry players who don't capitulate as soon as another team doesn't lie down in front of us.

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18 Apr 2016 11:20:52
Not a lot to disagree with Gerry, great post.

All I'll add is that it's been the case since MOs time. We've never built from a position of strength; in fact, most of our golden spells over the last 20 years, has been on the back of a resurgence. Tommy Burns/ Wim Jansen was post the Brady Macari debacles, MO was post Venglos, Barnes and Dalglish, and even Lennon's (relative) success was on the back of Mowbray. We are always looking to do "enough" - and for the most part, that included Rangers. Obviously with their off field issues, we then lowered that again to do "enough" to win the SPL and Qualify for the UCL two out of every three seasons - but again this was at a bare minimum required.

You look back to our Seville team, and in particular the final. We failed to build from a position of strength - and the following year Porto won the UCL.

Four years and we're no further forward.

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18 Apr 2016 11:24:24
We have played 52 competitive games so far - and were clearly tired and unfit.

Rangers played just 45 (most against part-timers and plumbers) .

its 11vs11 - they just piped us - as we had far more shots and hit crossbar several times.

We need to be fitter to cope with Europe pre-qualifiers (6 games) , Europe (6 games) - plus SPFL where few games are walks in the park.

Scottish game lost £10m each year.

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18 Apr 2016 12:06:40
I don't think this Board ever had ambition, They don't have any plan whatsoever all they want to do is buy players cheap and sell them at a profit at the expense of winning trophies! Time for them to step aside they have failed at a time when it is a one horse race!

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18 Apr 2016 12:09:01
Aye Andy as we all know most footballers in the Championship are plumbers. Thankfully though your 'team' didn't sit back with 10 men behind the ball like all our 'part time teams' have done all season long. No you at least tried to make a game of it which allowed us to play our free flowing brand of football and hence we passed you off the park.
Only surprise was we let you back into the game, twice when we should have been out of sight.
Never mind. Prove you're a big team and you may win your one horse race.

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18 Apr 2016 12:19:57
Poeticpatient, I think you only have to look at Aston villa to see what happens when a board try to operate on a shoestring budget. Three or four years ago Villa were usually around the top six, then their board decided to rein in their spending and they have declined every season since. They have now been relegated, and will now miss out on the huge TV money that kicks in next season.
I'm not for a minute saying Celtic will fall like that, but the principle is the same, if you stop trying to improve, it will eventually cost you in the long run. Villa have lost out big time on the TV money, and Celtic through trying to save a bit of money may well have missed out on £30m of Champions league money over the last couple of seasons.
All supporters ask is that the board do all they can to get the club as far forward as they can, if they do this fans will forgive defeats.

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18 Apr 2016 12:43:27
Mate Aston villa have been a bottom end of table team for years they not been around top 6 for a long time couldn't tell u that last time they had European football relegation for them was always on the card eventually there a poor run club that constantly change manager I don't think Celtic are in comparison with them at all! and Rangers only played 8 games In league against part time teams Andy just when yer posting yer random made up facts in the future a don't know if maths is your strong point but 8 games out of 45 that would leave 37 I would say that most games where against full time teams wouldn't u?

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18 Apr 2016 13:04:58
so ryan you saying rangers player 37 games against fulltimes - while we played 52?

So you make my point - we have played far more top level (euro/ spfl) - than rangers.

hence we are far more tired at end of long season.

Ronnie said we not fit enough - he right!

There is press frenzy (hugh keevins et al) to get ronny sacked, so we have new manager in time for Europe qualifiers and go out early again.

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18 Apr 2016 13:24:18
For goodness sake Andy we have a squad almost double every other team in Scotland our problem isn't the amount of games we play its how we utilise the players and coach them to apply tactics.

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18 Apr 2016 13:33:44
Gerry; you know my feelings on how our club has been mismanaged for years by a very complacent, short sighted regime and sadly this has been all to familiar for as long as I have supported Celtic. It was similar under the Kelly Dynasty.
The advantage we were given in 2012 to strengthen, consolidate and dominate without a recognised 'serious rival' has not only been passed-up, but totally disregarded as PL and co ensured their dividends and bonuses on the back of easy profits from any asset plucked from the dressing room, while 'rookie' managers had to 'mend and make do' with any old journeyman, injury-prone crock, mistaken identity, or You Tube - selected pig in a poke, Park recommended and 'Ron Manage'r accepted.
We are in this mess because of years of incompetence and neglect and no matter how badly we need a change for the better, there will not be a quick-fix to our predicament under the current set-up and there needs to be a groundswell to shake things up.
The defeat to lower league Sevco is one of the lowest points in the clubs history and someone has to take responsibility/ blame.

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18 Apr 2016 13:34:32
Andy, never mind keevins etc, wake up mate Ronnys banged on about fitness levels from the first day he walked through the doors at Celtic park. Are u telling me that the fitness levels of these players is what it should be? We've been watching this dross for the best part of Ronnys time in charge. Yesterday was just another example of how poor this side and management really are. Ronny will go, there's no doubt about that for me, if he doesn't and this shambles is allowed to continue let's wait and see what the gate figures are next season. Here's a question for you, we all know players get managers the sack that's a fact. What's it going to take for RD to get sacked and the mass clear out that's so badly needed from top to bottom?

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18 Apr 2016 13:43:17
I was just pointing out yer maths and poor excuse was nonsense and if players can't handle a full season competing in all competitions then maybe they should be playing for a lesser team that don't play as many games and don't want to compete for as long in the competitions they enter! And if the manager says the players ain't fit enough why are they in the team? celtic have a big squad am sure not all on there arse at this stage of the season.

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18 Apr 2016 13:45:52
Andy, struggle to accept your argument when RD has not played the same team consistently over the season, the only regulars are Gordon, Tierney, Lustig, Johansen and Griff. All others have has injuries or not had a run of more than 5 or so games.

Celtic gave TRIFC far too much respect, for periods we sat in with a bank of 4 defenders and 5 midfielders defending just inside our own terrority, little pressure on the ball, no hunting in packs, Celtic looked disjointed in every way.

I have been on here a few times re RD's position and Lawwells input. Fair enough Lawwell may be instructing players to play but the managers system should be adaptable to suit the players at your disposal. RD wanted improved fitness 3 Celtic players were struggling Biton, Lustig and Roberts towards the end of the game. RD wanted high tempo, not transpired to the pitch. RD wanted attacking football, maybe someone can help with RD's average goals for but for me his team scores less than previous managers.

I wanted RD to finish this season on a high. Many on here say league is the only important cup, but what's wrong with wanting more, wanting your/ my club to be successful in all cups. Poetic has hit the nail on the head, Celtic have never took advantage of a strong position i just hope he's also right about the change of manager generally brings a successful period.

We all look at that squad and see some shining lights in Tierney, Sviatchenko, Rogic, Griffiths. We have some untested in Christie, Allan, Henderson, Jozo. there's also experience in Lustig, Mulgrew and Bitton who could help new players/ youngsters. There is a nucleus of a decent team we need to add to it and build but most importantly we need a manager who can use the players in a suitable system.

RD should finish this season and go out with his head high, he came to Celtic an unknown and tried to instill his knowledge, footballing ideas into the biggest club in Scotland and one of Europe's best known teams. He has been reasonably successful winning the league and a few cups. He has done well for himself but the club and fans need a change in order to push the club on.

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18 Apr 2016 14:11:58
Jsean1989 I'm sorry but people like you are part of the problem "he's been reasonably successful" he's won one league and one cup so far and we are stuttering over the line playing terrible football for a second title when everyone accepts it's a one horse league. Let's not get started on Europe. Everyone says he's a nice guy with good ideas yet no one can see it materialising a good guy would offer his resignation but no he'll hang on for a full pay off which he's entitled to do.

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18 Apr 2016 15:34:00
Jim1972, so winning the league is not a success? Winning a cup is not a success? Getting to last 32 of Europe is not a success.

Jim my dear boy, you are a brain donor!

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18 Apr 2016 10:24:51
Why can't Celtic string 3 or 4 passes together in midfield? They always lose the ball after 1 or 2 passes. No wonder it always looks like the team is struggling the midfield is non-existent. Brown can't pass, Bitton far too casual on the ball. Johannson clearly hasn't been right all season. We just seem to slug games out and rely heavily on Leigh G.

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18 Apr 2016 10:11:46
I think deila has to go now as it would allow the new manager to see the squad we have. What's everyone else think now or summer.

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18 Apr 2016 10:40:22
Now without a shadow of any doubt, enough is enough!

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18 Apr 2016 10:47:17
I know it seems odd sacking a manger with five matches to play and the league an odds on certainty but I just feel that RD has lost 95% of the fans. However, most of the current players simply aren't that good and certainly hasn't made his job any easier.

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18 Apr 2016 11:02:54
Totally agree Dempsey! He should have been sacked 1st thing this morning! How much longer and how many more embarssing defeats do we need to witness before this guy goes! That yesterday was pathetic! To get dominated like that by a diddy team from Scotland's 2nd tier is inexusable! But it's just another to add to the list I'm afraid! Gutless clueless and leaderless! Go now and take Collins and Kennedy with him! Let a new manager get in there and clear out the dross who are picking up a wage for f**k all! Brown boyata johannsen gms ambrose bitton to name a few! Brown yesterday was pathetic once again! Passed rings round about him yet again! Awful! Time for change now, not the end of the season! NOW!

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18 Apr 2016 11:11:40
I was half expecting a 'mutual parting of the ways' so that both parties could save some face, however, with the league title still very much in our own hands, they may have agreed a stay of execution and let him leave on a 'hollow' high note?
The big worry is how the players will react to this major set-back embarrassment and does it actually jeopardise the 'five in a row'?

Whatever they decide there is no hiding from the fact that the club is at present in disarray, letting another two trophies slip away in games where we failed miserably to perform, compete or even turn up, while many league games have been at best average.
The whole season has been full of mediocre performances, lack of confidence or cohesion and worst of all no fight or pride.
The players [barring two or three] must take the bulk of the blame, but the buck stops at the management team and above.

There should be a delegation from Celtic speaking to Roy Keane at this very moment, begging him to take the job - and before people start criticising his record in England, we have had many a boss, who failed miserably at one English team or another, but did a very good job at Celtic Park.
We need an assertive, no-nonsense, strong personality to sort out the mess at our club and prepare us properly for all the battles and challenges on all fronts and get us back to a level the supporters deserve and appreciate.

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18 Apr 2016 12:41:28
The only reason RD is still there is not too save his face but PL's. There is a serious concern at Celtic park about whether we can secure the two wins and a draw to clinch the league, (probably Aberdeen will drop some points which will help us) Anyway Lawell won't sack him because if we did lose the league he would be the CEO who sacked the manager while the team was leading the league with five games to go. That wouldn't look good on his CV and believe me that is all that matters to the bold Peter. Well that and how many seasons tickets he can sell. I am afraid this is the same as the last days of the Whytes and Kelly's they only act when the fans stop turning up.

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18 Apr 2016 14:02:42
di canio anyone?

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18 Apr 2016 09:36:55
So. Who thinks Celtic are improving on and off the field under this current Board. A simple yes/ no will do.

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18 Apr 2016 10:26:30
100% - No . Simple answer.

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18 Apr 2016 10:36:03
That's not really the easiest question to answer stan. Celtic have been regressing since Lennon's last year or 2. Lennon left because of the lack of funds. I don't know whether that was because of Rangers dying or because of the state of Scottish football or just because they're greedy basses and don't want to spend. I was happy with the plan when Ronny came in. Having good Scottish players, bringing kids through and improving the players we have but yesterday really hit home with how much we've regressed. THIS WAS A CHAMPIONSHIP TEAM! Not for the first time we've being saying there is no fight in the team and right now that falls on the management. Ronny has to walk with whatever dignity he has left. A lovely man but no longer for Celtic. The plan may stay the same and God only knows who will come in or if the money will be there to spend.

Sorry got off track. To answer your question we have not improved on the last 4 years but there are a lot of factors to take into account.

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18 Apr 2016 11:50:31
There isn't a straight yes and no answer to that question
Lawwel took over in 2003 and we have had quite a bit of success in that time. Consistently winning trophies and have reached the later stages in European football a few times.
Have we improved off the field?
In terms of finance yes
Look outside our stadium yes
But lately there has been a serious rift forming between the board and fans and we have wasted the few years with the Ronny experiment that just hasn't worked

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18 Apr 2016 12:43:14
As simple a question as could be, we are dire and getting worse each week.

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18 Apr 2016 08:57:41
Now the dust is beginning to settle let's look at the situation and some bare facts. We have a side here that 95% of us think is rank rotten and the other 5% think we're just not very good, then we've got the tribute act who's fans are ecstatic with the quality of football they're watching and reckon they're a quality side. The result yesterday was 2-2 and if we had taken our clear cut chances we would of won the game. When you look at it this way which set of fans are right? with the game ending in a draw are we both rank rotten like We believe our team to be or are we both world beaters like they believe their team to be? I think we know the answer to that. At the end of the day they have the 2nd biggest wage bill in Scotland and in a cup tie this can happen. The way I see it there is still a huge gulf between us and the rest, we can only improve, we are performing at a minimum with our resources the rest are performing at maximum with their resources.

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18 Apr 2016 10:19:22
Yes stevie in a cup tie it can happen as it did yesterday just a shame your fans couldn't accept that last week majority of yese had it that u only had to turn up and it would be a stroll in the park some where even disgusted that some rangers fans actually thought they could win! yes we have the 2nd biggest budget but it's not even close to yours it's cup football won't be the last time the match favourite loses the tie the game could have went either way but I believe the better team on the day went through.

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18 Apr 2016 12:25:52
Agree with most of that Ryan and yes it should of been a comfortable win for us but again like too often in the last couple of seasons we failed to perform to an acceptable level considering the standard of player at our disposal I.e all Internationalists .The blame lies firmly at the door of our management team unable to mould those players into some kind of team. I'm not saying our squad is full of top quality players but individually they are far better than anything in Scotland and to not be able to put a team together to dominate Scottish football in the present climate is purely down to being a very poor coach.

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18 Apr 2016 13:04:37
I've not seen enough Celtic games to say if your manager is any good or not stevie going by on here a lot of your fellow supporters he's not but then he has a few backers on here too! from an outside point of view I think he's had raw deal with regards players brought in for him and some would say not his choices! am a firm believer a manager is the most important person at a football club and for him to come over to a new country to manage I think he should have been allowed to bring his own team of staff he knows and trusts to do a job for him and to be given John Collins was a bit crap as he comes across as a total ⚽️👜 of a man! i think many will get there wish and the management will be replaced at end of the season.

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18 Apr 2016 07:11:29
To all Celtic fans going to work this morning, keep your head up, smile and don't bite. Maintain your dignity. Under new management next season we will come good. Things will get better. Hail hail.

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18 Apr 2016 07:21:28
I think your post is naive if you think that changing mansgement suddenly things will get better cause we need a massive overhaul.

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18 Apr 2016 07:31:41
I think we are all big enough to congratulate a wee team from the lower leagues getting to their first ever Scottish Cup Final. (If ye didnae laff, ye'd greet)

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18 Apr 2016 07:43:17
I think your being naive if you think there's going to be a massive overhaul. Management team and some players will be moved on that's what will happen. A new manager with half a clue will make a difference from the get go i'm sure. that's my positive opinion. Just RD going will bring a bit of light to the situation. At least we know then that change is under way.

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18 Apr 2016 07:55:37
Only news I'm looking for today is hearing that RD and his staff have either resigned or been sacked. Anything less is unacceptable. And these players who think they're getting off Scott free better think again as at least half if not more should be shown the door aswell.

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18 Apr 2016 08:24:34
Let's stop kidding ourselves here Celtic is a shambles at the moment and its because of the Board. From being in a position of strength in 2003 to this! In that time we have seen Rangers die. So what do we do? Sell our best players and replace them with garbage. These are the facts and that's why there is easy 15,000 fans, sometime more staying away. I am one of them. People can say i ant a true fan. quite the opposite and i am not prepared to keep paying thousands of pounds a year to these leeches on following my team home and away plus endless supply of merchandise when i have a family to feed. i will not be going back to Celtic Park unless there is massive changes at our Club, We have a shareholder who thinks he can turn up when he wants and use us as his toy. The man can't even attend AGM . As for Lawell go run a business that has nothing to do with football that's what you will be good at because the balance sheet is more important to you than winning trophies etc. This is the views of thousands not just me. You are a liar if you don't know friends (diehards) who have stopped going. Yesterday will go down as one of the worst results in our history and if Celtic fans are prepared to put up with the way this Club is being run then you may aswel get used to failure because Rangers wnt take long to overtake us at this rate. Seriously think about that! they died and we all laughed. Who is laughing now! DD and PL leave now so we can get new investement and new people with fresh ideas and an actually plan to take us forward on and off the park because you have failed miserably!

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18 Apr 2016 08:46:17
Bang on the money stan . I for one have decided if the management team remain next season i will not renew season tickets . this has to stop one way or another.

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18 Apr 2016 10:55:05
Dn30 your right to say our club needs a complete overhaul but that won't happen IMO. If you don't think a new manager could improve us you are being naive as with our squad I would expect a better product and results than what we are getting. We have played in two semi finals this season against inferior opposition and player selection and tactics have been wrong as it has been for many many months now. A new manager doesn't cure everything but we have to stop the rot now. Season tickets are due out soon but many people won't renew unless there is a clear indication put out by the club on who will be in charge I would also like the associations to speak out for their members and supporters as we nearly all agree change is required. To ed what are your thoughts moving forward do you still think ronny should be here next term.

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18 Apr 2016 15:32:32
Jim1972 i agree a massive overhaul won't happen, but it is naive to suggest a new manager will suddenly drastically improve team. There will still be meddling from board, still players signed by John Park and still the same constraints in place.

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18 Apr 2016 02:42:23
Good question and I'll answer it no problem. (In answer to paythefacepainters post earlier)

Who would you keep and bin?

All to keep.

GK - Gordon, Bailly, Fasan? (Although I do still feel we should be actively looking for a new number 1)

DF - Erik, Simunovic?, Ambrose, Tierney, Izaguirre, Janko, Lustig, Fisher? (New CB required, well covered in Full back areas)

MF - Bitton, Commons, Christie, Allan, Rogic, Roberts, McGregor, Forrest, Henderson?, Nesbitt? (New CM and LW required)

ST - Griffiths, Kazim Richards (Two new strikers required)

Question marks over some of those players I've mentioned but all in all we're not in THAT bad in shape squad wise, around 5 new signings in key areas during the Summer and we're good to go, the problem is very much Ronny who continues to play inferior players over better players who are either on the bench or in the stands, incompetence from the manager.

Stokes, Scepovic, Armstrong, GMS, Ciftci, Brown, Boyata, Duffy, Cole, Johansen, Blackett, Mulgrew all need canned.

Feel slightly bad putting Mulgrew in amongst that lot after he played decent against Sevco but his injuries over the last couple seasons and being prone to some howlers we should wish him well to pastures new.

Coincidently it's not surprising a lot of those players I've mentioned that need binned have played the majority of the season in the first team.

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18 Apr 2016 08:31:16
KEEP
FASAN. loan him see what he can do
BAILLY. cover
LUSTIG. needs to get fit struggled with injuries/ fitness no cover due to janko I juries. fisher loan
JANKO. needs a run to see if any good
FISHER. as with janko
SHEVvY
SIMO
TIERNEY. but will pl sell him?
MCGREGOR. squad
CHRISTIE. As with janko fisher
HENDERSON.
ROBERTS. squad
ROGIC
Griffiths.

WHAT'S NEEDED
experienced/ proven cb
Experienced/ proven cm
PLAYMAKER best we can buy.
Expirienced/ proven dm
Experienced/ proven lw
Two strikers

I'd like to see us going for experience as we have some great talent coming through in youth's . let them be the squad players instead of bringing in cheap rubbish

.

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18 Apr 2016 01:57:26
Looked at the Celtic wpedia the ins outs page and seen we've signed 65 ayers since lennon took over . talk about quantity over quality. that's a full team every season over the last 6 seasons.

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18 Apr 2016 00:32:47
MASSIVE CLEAR OUT REQUIRED

Ronny and Collins need to go

With Lawwell following them

John Kennedy moved back to a youth coach

A new manager has to be brought in asap and this needs to be spot on with him given a very decent budget and backed full tilt a lot more than in previous years, MO'N esque backing is required

Player Wise

A new captain is required, Brown is not up to it and never has been as I've been telling everyone from the day I became a member on here and it looks like people are finally finding him out

For us to progress as a side we need to shift A LOT of deadwood this Summer permanently if possible, that means.

GMS, Armstrong, Ciftci, Brown, Johansen, Boyata, Stokes, Scepovic and Cole all need to be moved on if we are to progress as a side.

A new striker or two required and we have to get these signings bang on this time no more Pukki/ Balde/ Scepovic/ Bangura esque signings any more. Two TOP quality strikers who we can rely on to take chances at the highest level it's time to get serious, no offence to Griffiths he's done well this season domestically but we need better, much better.

A proper left winger is also required

As is another CB and a CM

Do this and with still some of the players we've got we should be looking a lot better next season with a competent manager in charge.

Believable4 Unbelievable0

18 Apr 2016 01:10:09
I posted about Nemanja Nikolic and Vicent Janssen although the latter might be pricey. Also hope we get Elyounoussi as he has goals from midfield and done well against us in Europe. I really hope all this penny pinching and cutbacks was so we have a big budget for the season this lot are in the league.

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18 Apr 2016 02:14:42
Pricey or not now is the time for action, REAL action. I believe this has been the MASSIVE wake up call the board needed and we will get a reaction there's no doubt about it in my mind this Summer. We will get a new competent manager and he will be given a very big budget and backed accordingly with at least £15-20M this Summer recruitments are needed of seismic proportions. Two STs, LW, CM and CB.

I would suggest striker wise Jonathan Soriano at Salzburg and Wissam Ben Yedder at Toulouse personally. Had a look at your two suggestions though and they look decent players as well bravetart86.

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18 Apr 2016 03:06:25
Soriano would cost minimum 6mill. jansenn a bit more. (we looked at jannsenn when he was at Almere city ) . so forget these two.

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18 Apr 2016 08:06:07
I think your doing armstrong a disservice . he's the ideal cm you talk about why spend x amount of money when any manager with sense can see he's been played out off position since he came . the rest off them i would have to agree although johanson in my opinion has been hampered this season personally i think its more to do with what's going on behind the scenes (what that is i don't know ) but its been a dramatic fall ftom last season for him.

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18 Apr 2016 14:47:24
Soriano would be a fan favourite and least we know he can take a penalty :P Haven't heard of the Toulouse guy will YouTube him. But with the extra income from Revenue with Rangers in the league next season also with the new Dafabet sponsorship player sales and all the penny pinching for the past 4 years surely 15-20m isn't out of the question. I'd rather we done all business in the summer than splitting money between 2 windows. Definitely need a new spine to the team after yesterday's performance was spineless. Johansen needs to prove himself not sure when his contracts up but if he doesn't perform then maybe cut our losses in Jan.

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18 Apr 2016 00:19:27
Still can't believe the outcome of today. How Johansen started ahead of Rogic is beyond me. Brown was terrible, Biton bottled it, GMS went missing the entire game, Boyata was a liability thank god he came off or it may have been an embarrassing scoreline! Also surprised not to see Commons play a part too. Another under par performance but still should've won and what was Thomson doing over ruling a linesman when he's not 100% certain his vision was totally blocked! That game was more of a gauge for next season than what it was made out to be, the gap has closed and we know a lot aren't up to the job. No fight or no bottle. The board need to punt a few of the dross and listen to any offers for Biton and Johansen and invest heavily in the summer. 3 key singings I'd like to see is Kara Mbodj in DM (Anderlecht) Elyonouissi on the wing (Molde) And either Vincent Janssen ST (AZ) or Nemanja Nikolic ST (Legia) pretty sure the fans can expect that with the money made on player sales and budget.

Believable0 Unbelievable1

18 Apr 2016 00:35:01
As much I would love Vincent Jansen to sign for Celtic and agree that the eredevise is a good market for us, the chances of him singing for us are next to nothing.

He is Hollands first choice striker now, top scorer in the eredevise and still young with a host of European clubs chasing us, so doubt we could afford his shinpads.

Agree with your point regarding the squad however.

From the current bunch, I would only keep:

Gordon, Tierney, Simunovic, Lustig (squad player at least) , Christie, Allan (needs more of a chance) , Rogic, Griffiths and Sviatchenko.

Also hope to see Henderson brought back in to the fold next season.

A lot of experience and talent needed.

TommyTwists.

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18 Apr 2016 01:00:53
When you break it down to whom you. Will keep there is a decent lot of players there just need to add a good few quality additions. That's why I said or Nemanja Nikolic thought Janssen would be a bit pricey and hopefull. Nikolic was signed on a free and has a very good scoring record should be able to get him around £2.5m-3m we could cover that with sales of Stokes Ciftci and Scepovic. A good goalscorer will score in most leagues given the chance, All these flops/ projects have never been goalscorers. Think Griffiths/ Nikolic would be a deadly partnership. I'd be happy for Henderson to replace Brown in MF he's a better all round player.

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